§ Lord Monteaglesaid he had moved for certain papers relative to the spirit duties in Ireland, which were now laid upon the Table, and he wished to call their Lordships' attention to the fact that, although it had been suggested by a noble Lord on the cross Benches on the occasion when he (Lord Monteagle) moved for these returns, that it was probable that the decrease in the revenue was attributable, not to the effect of the duty, but to the progress of the temperance movement, the papers in question, now they were produced, showed a very different result. The alarming fact brought out by the returns, as showing 336 the connection between the crime of illicit distillation and the consumption of spirits, was that, whereas the number of persons imprisoned on charges of offences against the distillery laws was 53 in the month of January, 1842, it had increased in the same month in the present year to 225. The number of detections of such offences in the first named year was 193, while in 1843 it had increased to 1,040. The number of convictions had increased in the same period from 67 to 234. Now, he would ask any noble Lord, whether these returns did not prove most conclusively, in connexion with the fact that the great increase in crime dated from the increase of duty, and taken also in connexion with the diminished amount of spirits upon which duty had been paid, that illicit distillation had most wofully increased? His noble Friend behind him (the Marquess of Lansdowne) bad most truly said, that there was no greater enemy to the spread of the beneficial doctrines of Father Mathew than the practice of illicit distillation. He was in a position to prove that the persons who had been committed to prison were persons who, under the former state of the law, were members of temperance societies and wore medals, thereby proving them at one time worthy followers of Father Mathew. In pressing the question so often upon the House, he totally excluded all party motives. He did so because he conscientiously believed that all the vices, all the crimes, all the illegal combinations which were the bane of Ireland were maintained, supported, and encouraged by the pernicious practice of illicit distillation. He urged, and would continue to urge, the question upon the attention of the Government, for he viewed it as of the very utmost importance, and he looked at it with much apprehension. Before what was usually termed the budget was introduced to the notice of Parliament, he trusted that some Member of the Government would relieve the alarm which prevailed in Ireland, by stating that it was their intention to reconsider the subject. Should it not be so, he would certainly bring the whole question under the serious consideration of their Lordships. The purpose of the Government had been good, but, so far from filling the Treasury, the result of the measure had only been to fill the gaols. He moved that the papers be printed.
The Earl of Wicklowreturned his thanks to his noble Friend for keeping the subject so continually before the House, and he hoped he would persevere until he had elicited a declaration from the Government upon the subject. The Government most undoubtedly had not anticipated the evils which had resulted from the measure; he had felt great apprehension of its working at the time it was proposed, and he must admit that those apprehensions had been more than verified; for, while it had produced the most enormous evils, it had been attended with no advantage whatever. He confessed that he had witnessed the introduction of the bill for raising the spirit duty in Ireland with very great surprise; but that surprise was much increased when he saw it accompanied by the withdrawal of the drawback formerly allowed upon spirits made from malt. That was as direct an encouragement of private distillation as raising the duty was. Private distillation was not merely for the purpose of producing a cheaper article, its object was as much to produce a better article than that produced by the licensed distiller, and one more acceptable to the taste of the people. These two circumstances combined had contributed much to foster that which was the master-vice of Ireland. He sincerely hoped that the Government would most seriously consider the matter, and that some of its members would before long inform the House of their intention to alter the act of last Session so as to bring the duty at least as low as before last year, if not lower.
The Marquess of Clanricardecordially joined with the noble Earl in rendering thanks to his noble Friend for his perseverance upon this subject. The returns moved for by his noble Friend clearly proved that crime had greatly increased, and every noble Lord who was connected with Ireland, or who resided in that country, was well aware that illicit distillation had also very much increased, and that the two were inseparably connected with each other. He was perfectly aware that it would be said that the extremely low price of corn had produced as much effect as the high duty. He would not attempt to deny that proposition, but the lowness of price Was foreseen when the duty was raised. Supposing that a return should show that it had produced an increased revenue, it 338 must not be at once taken for granted that the increase was real. He was informed that the increased expense of the collection did away with the supposed advantage to the revenue, and those expenses were much increased by the necessary prosecutions, which had become very numerous. He was sorry to say that he believed there had of late been no great increase of the followers of temperance, because, although there was an increase in one place, it was balanced by a falling off in others. The good which the exertions of Father Mathew had done could never be entirely effaced; but it now became the duty of the Government and of Parliament to attempt to rid Ireland of that which had ever been its bane and the root of all other crimes, viz., illicit distillation. No one could for a moment mix up party spirit with such a question, and he had no doubt, if her Majesty's Government were to be convinced that the additional duty had been the means of greatly increasing crime, they would consent at once to reduce it.
§ Lord Ashburtonsaid, the noble Lord opposite (Lord Monteagle) had misunderstood what had fallen from him on a former occasion. He had not questioned the truth of the statements of the noble Lord; all he said was, that the figures produced by him on that occasion did not prove them. He did not question the prudence of the noble Lord, but he would put it to him whether it would not be better to wait to see what were the intentions of her Majesty's Government upon the subject, because the facts, if assisted by several noble Lords, could not fail to attract their most serious attention. He understood the extra duty on spirit distilled in Ireland was imposed as an alternative for the Income-tax, which was imposed on this country. The present experiment having failed, it would become a duty of the Legislature to inquire whether, if relief were given, that tax ought not to be extended to Ireland.
§ Returns to be printed.