Lords Sitting of 15 May 1840

MINUTES.
Petitions presented. By Lord Rayleigh, from Walworth, in favour of Church Extension.—By the Earl of Rosebery, from Selkirk, praying for Remuneration to the Post-masters on account of Increased Duties.—By the Earl of Winchilsea, the Earl of Redesdale, and the Earl of Stradbroke, from Suffolk, Northampton, and various places, against the Repeal of the Corn-laws.—By the Earl of Winchilsea, from Northampton, against any Grant to Maynooth College.

MR. O'CONNELL'S SEDITIOUS LANGUAGE.
The Marquess of Westmeathpresented a a petition from certain inhabitants of Bath, complaining that measures were not taken to punish sedition in Ireland as it was punished in this country. The petitioners stated, that on the 10th day of April last, a society was formed in Dublin for the avowed purpose of repealing the union between the two countries, in which association seditious and inflammatory language was used by Mr. D. O'Connell and other persons, of which no notice had been taken. The petitioners were of opinion that it was alike contrary to justice and humanity to prosecute and punish poor labourers for sedition, while Mr. D. O'Connell and his friends were allowed, without molestation, to use the most inflammatory language. They could not conceive why sedition should be connived at, if not encouraged, by the government in Ireland, while it was prosecuted and punished in England. They, therefore, prayed their Lordships to address her Majesty that she would be graciously pleased to command the Attorney-general to issue proceedings against all such offenders, of whatsoever
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rank and degree, and to vindicate the laws of the land. This petition was signed by 112 most respectable persons. Though he entered fully into their feelings, he was rather surprised at the simplicity of the parties in supposing for a moment that the Government would direct the prosecution of those who were guilty of sedition in Ireland, when the law officers of the Crown were appointed at the instance of the persons whose conduct was complained of. He could assure the noble Viscount, that if he had at any time during these latter years conciliated the support of the country gentlemen in Ireland, instead of depending on the eleemosynary support on which he now depended, he would be considerably more at his ease as Prime Minister than he now was, and would be more secure in the situation to which he so anxiously adhered, than he could hope to be by any guarantee he might receive from the objectionable quarter to which he had alluded.
Petition laid on the table.

POOR LAWS (IRELAND).
The Earl of Glengallcomplained that the papers relative to the proceedings of the Poor-law Commissioners in Ireland, which had been laid on the table, were not satisfactory. He wished that the correspondence relative to the appointment of surgeon Phelan should be produced.
The Marquess of Normanbydid not believe that there was any correspondence on the subject, but he would make inquiry.
The Duke of Wellingtonsaid, that looking to the extensive powers which the board possessed, it was right that all correspondence connected with the appointment of officers should be produced, for the purpose of enabling their Lordships to trace such appointments to their origin. If, however, there was no correspondence, a return of names and offices should at least be made.
The Marquess of Normanbysaid, he would make inquiry with respect to any correspondence that might have occurred, but he feared that the return would be nil.
Lord Ellenboroughsaid, that yesterday a collection of papers had been laid on the table relative to the valuation of property in reference to the Irish poor-law. In the 33rd paragraph of the instructions to those who were to estimate the annual value of premises, it was set forth "that it is desirable that the amount should not include fractions of a pound, unless where the value of the premises is very low." Now

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this direction of the commissioners was contrary to the law. The law required that the valuation should he absolutely and strictly correct; and those who made the valuation were not warranted in departing from the law in consideration of the greater convenience of giving the value in pounds rather than the fractions of pounds. Therefore he hoped that the noble Marquis would immediately cause that 33rd clause to he withdrawn, and thus prevent the value of premises really below 10 l. from being improperly raised to 10 l. The tendency of the instruction was to encourage false statements as to the value of property, of which noble Lords had so frequently complained.
Subject at an end.

MUNICIPAL CORPORATIONS (IRELAND).
Counsel having been further heard against the Municipal Corporations (Ireland) Bill, and having withdrawn,
Viscount Melbournewished to ask whether there were any objection to the House then going into Committee upon the bill?
The Duke of Wellingtonsaid, he had the strongest objection. He could not consent to go into Committee without a discussion in a full House, nor till he saw what was meant to be done upon the subject of another measure, which might be considered as part of this bill, and which was not yet before their Lordships. He told the noble Viscount that he could not consent to go into Committee until this other measure was before the House, and it was really known what the intention of her Majesty's Government was upon the subject.
Viscount Melbournesaid, then he should propose next Friday for going into Committee, by which time the other bill would be before the House.
The Earl of Glengallthought it most important that the bill now before the other House of Parliament for the abolition of the grand jury cess in several great towns of Ireland should come before their Lordships before they went into Committee upon the present bill.
The Marquess of Westmeathcould not suffer the House to adjourn without expressing his gratification that the bill was not to be hastily proceeded with, for he felt confident that the continuance or the dissolution of the connexion of Great Britain and Ireland depended upon their Lordships' considering and discussing the provisions of this important measure in a cool, calm, and deliberate manner.
Viscount Melbournewould on Friday
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next move that the House go into Committee upon the bill.
Adjourned.