Lords Sitting of 25 April 1839

MINUTES.
Petitions presented. By the Earl of RODEN, from one place, against any further Grant to Maynooth
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College.—By the Marquess of BUTE, from Dumbarton, against any further Grant to the Scotch Church.—By the Earl of SHAFTESBURY, from one place, for Protection to the Church in the Colonies.—By the Earls of ALBEMARLE, and RADNOR, and another noble LORD, from several places, for a Uniform Penny Postage.—By Lord WHARNCLIFFE, from one place, against any system of National Education not founded on the Principles of the Established Church.—By the Duke of RUTLAND, from one place, against the Repeal of the Corn-laws

GAOL DELIVERIES.
The Duke of Richmondgave notice, that it was his intention to-morrow, to move for certain returns, which, in his humble opinion, were of great importance, as they concerned the due administration of the criminal law. It had been for a long time the practice of the magistrates in Sussex, to commit persons charged with small offences for trial at the quarter sessions; but it happened sometimes that between the committal and the holding of the sessions the assizes intervened, and cases had occurred where prisoners, whose names did not appear on the calendar, who were imprisoned and waiting for trial at the quarter sessions, had been discharged by the judge by proclamation. He did not mean in the slightest degree to impugn the conduct of the judge for taking this course, but he wished the matter to be settled one way or another, whether persons thus committed should be tried at the quarter sessions or at the intervening assizes. For the purpose of bringing the subject before their Lordships, he should to-morrow move "for a return of all prisoners waiting for trial in the different prisons and houses of correction in England and Wales at the last assizes, whose names were not in the calendar, specifying their offences, and those discharged by proclamation."
Lord Broughamquite agreed with his noble Friend as to the discrepancy of the law upon this point, and that nothing could be worse than that discrepancy. At the same time he rather thought that it would be found, from what he had collected, that the learned judge could not have done otherwise than he did.
The Duke of Richmondsaid, that in this instance there was only one gaol in the county, and the assizes were held at the house of correction. The witnesses in question were bound over to appear and prosecute at the quarter sessions.
Lord A bingersaid, as he was the judge who had been alluded to he might be permitted to make a few observations. The duty of the magistrates was to commit

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prisoners in such manner that they might take their trial as speedily as possible after commitment. If magistrates had power to commit over an assizes to an adjourned quarter sessions, they might commit from one adjourned sessions to another for six months. The general rule was, that the judge should discharge the gaol, particularly of all prisoners whose names were in the calendar. In this instance the name of the prisoner was in the calendar; he was called up by proclamation, and he felt bound to discharge him. He thought it would be very convenient if the noble Duke would take this opportunity of bringing in a bill to govern the practice, leaving no discretion to the judges whatever.
The Duke of Richmondsaid, on this occasion there was a difference of fact between the noble and learned Lord and himself. According to the information which he had received, the prisoners to whom he alluded were not in the custody of the Sheriff at all, but in the custody of the keeper of the House of Correction, and his motion was for a return of those only whose names were not in the Calendar. His object was, that there should be a uniform rule.
Lord Denmansaid, there was a difference of opinion on the subject, and the noble Duke would do great service to his country by bringing in a Bill to settle the question.
Notice given.

TURKEY AND EGYPT.
Lord Broughamhad been very much gratified on a former occasion at the answer which he had received from the noble Viscount at the head of her Majesty's Government, when he made an inquiry as to the course which Ministers meant to pursue with respect to any dispute that might arise between the Grand Seignor and Mehemet Ali, the Pasha of Egypt. He had been then informed that the strictest neutrality would be observed between the two parties. Now, it was highly desirable that this intention should be carried fully into effect, and that the rule thus laid down with respect to Egyptian affairs should be strictly adhered to, that rule being, that no encouragement or assistance should be given to either party, but that a decided neutrality should be kept up with respect to both. Circumstances had occurred, however, which, to the untutored mind,
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as it was termed, of the Pasha, might appear to warrant the conclusion, or might lead him to suppose—that the British Government had a leaning more to one side than to the other. He alluded to five sail-of-the-line having been sent out to cruise in his neighbourhood, and also to the fact that a number of British officers had gone out to Turkey, and had enlisted in the service of the Grand Seignor. This certainly might be considered as looking something like a leaning more to one side than the other, as, in fact, a departure from strict neutrality, and he should be glad to have some explanation on the subject.
Viscount Melbournesaid, there was not the smallest alteration in the policy of her Majesty's Government with reference to this question. True it was, that some officers had gone out for the purpose of improving the Turkish navy, but, owing to some misunderstanding, they had not yet entered the Sultan's service, but remained unemployed at Constantinople. This country still continued completely neutral, and nothing whatsoever had been done in contradiction to the line of policy which he had declared on a former occasion. The policy of Government still remained precisely the same, and he was happy to say that they had received from all their allies the most distinct and explicit declarations that they meant to adhere to the same neutral course of policy, and that they would use all the means in their power to prevent hostilities taking place between these two parties. He thought it right to state, that her Majesty's representative at the Turkish Court had received the most distinct and positive instructions to use his best efforts, in conjunction with the representatives of other Powers, to preserve peace in that part of the world.
Lord Broughamrejoiced that he had afforded the noble Viscount an opportunity to make so satisfactory a statement.
Subject dropped.