§ Viscount Melbournemoved the Order of the Day for taking into consideration the Commons' Amendments to the Ecclesiastical Appointments' Suspension Bill. The object of the clause introduced by the Commons was to remedy a difficulty which had been occasioned by the Bill of last year, and to enable the Chapters to elect Deans, in case of a vacancy by death.
The Bishop of Exetersaid, that he was obliged to oppose the Amendment. The Bill on which this Amendment was made, was a Bill operating on the Ecclesiastical Appointments' Suspension Act of last year. So far, the Amendment might have something to do with the Bill; but the present Bill was not for the purpose of amending that Act but for another purpose. The Bill was introduced for the purpose of remedying certain inconveniences in visitations, and to that was appended a clause of an entirely different character. He thought that it would be 228 better to introduce a separate Bill, and then the House would have the opportunity of maturely considering the subject. The real object of the clause however, was, to enable the Crown to do that which it could not do at present respecting the Deanery at Exeter. The Crown had claimed a right to insist upon that Chapter electing a Dean under the appointment of the Crown. The Chapter, while they did not think proper to give up their right to a free election, rejoiced to find, and he concurred in that feeling, that the Crown had granted the Deanery of Exeter to two individuals of the highest character and merits. The noble Lord first appointed was undoubtedly entitled to all the encomiums which had been passed upon him. In the communications which had passed between the noble Viscount and the Chapter of Exeter, the latter had expressed their apprehensions that some retrospective measure would be introduced. But still they had been kept in ignorance of this amendment.
§ Viscount Melbourneadmitted, that this clause had in view the filling up the vacancy of the Deanery of Exeter, and that that Deanery should be filled up in the ordinary course. He admitted that he had stated to the Chapter of Exeter, that there could be no object in view but to preserve the usual course of the Crown, the regularity of proceedings, and that the legal rights of all parties should be preserved. Unquestionably he did not intend to introduce any clause calculated to interfere with what was already vested and established in the Chapter, nor could it be his intention to press this clause if he could understand that it was contrary to the wishes, or the feelings, or the intentions of the Chapter; but front all the communications he had had with the Chapter, he understood the Chapter had no desire but to be able to carry into effect the wishes of the Crown in the usual and regular manlier, and that if they could do so, they were very willing to take the necessary steps to effect the Crown's recommendation. When he advised her Majesty to appoint Mr. Grills to this Deanery, he thought he was getting rid of all difficulties. At first he was not aware that it was necessary that the party to be elected should be a Canon residentiary. The Suspension Bill prevented Mr. Grills being a Canon residentiary, and this clause was to remove the difficulty. If 229 he were told that the Chapter were against it he would not persevere in it.
The Bishop of Exetersaid, he had not stated that the Chapter of Exeter were against it; he had said, they were not for it. He thought the party ought to be one of the present Canons, and he wished to know from the noble Viscount if he was not aware that if the Crown were to recommend to the Chapter one of the Canons qualified by the statute, they would not, without acknowledging a power in the Crown to compel them, be ready from their own feeling of loyalty, to elect such an individual so recommended?
Lord Melbournebelieved the Chapter were ready to elect this gentleman, recommended as he was, if they were enabled to do so, and for the purpose of enabling them to act according to the usual course, this clause was proposed.
§ The Duke of Wellingtonthought the House was placed in an awkward situation. He was glad to hear that the noble Viscount and the Chapter were on such good and accommodating terms with each other. He should have wished, however, to have had some information afforded to him upon this subject at an earlier period than at the very moment at which the House was called upon to agree to this clause—which he could not but think was a very great irregularity, and more especially when it was connected with this particular arrangement or disposition to a negotiation between the Crown and Chapter of Exeter. He thought it would be as well for the Crown, for the Chapter of Exeter, and for all parties concerned, that this clause should become the subject of a distinct Bill to pass through Parliament. Let it be regularly, fully, openly brought before the House and the public. He did not like to reject a clause that had been proposed by the other House of Parliament, but he certainly thought that the House ought to have a fair opportunity of discussing this question fully.
The Bishop of Salisburyconsidered that this and other irregularities which were degrading to the Church, arose from a mode of legislation which he believed to be equally unconstitutional and inconvenient. All the difficulties had arisen from the Suspension Act, which this Bill referred to, and which had now been renewed during three successive Sessions. In his opinion, the best mode of proceeding would be to repeal the Suspension Act.
The Earl of Wicklowsaid, whether the noble Viscount postponed this clause, or pressed it upon the House now, he should equally object to it. He objected upon principle to either House of Parliament adding a clause to a Bill totally unconnected with the subject of that Bill itself. He should certainly object to the clause in this form, whenever it was brought forward.
The Marquess of Salisburyconsidered that the House ought to be summoned on the present occasion, and, therefore, perhaps the noble Viscount would postpone the further consideration of the clause.
Lord Melbournethought there was no use in postponing it. It was but a very small matter. There might be something in the point of form, but nothing of importance. With respect to there being any concealment about the matter, there was nothing of the sort, and there had been ample opportunities given in both Houses of Parliament, for the discussion of the matter. The noble Duke opposite seemed to speak of this as if there was something of a discreditable nature about it. It was well known that inconvenience had been suffered by the delay which had been unexpectedly occasioned by the Bill which had been passed, and this clause was to remedy that evil. It was admitted, that it was to carry into effect the arrangement for the Deanery of Exeter. It would unquestionably, in his opinion, be better to carry this into effect, in the mode proposed by the House of Commons. At the same time, as the objections to it seemed to be felt so strongly, he did not think it was necessary for him to persevere farther with it at present.
§ The Duke of Wellingtoncould not agree that full opportunities of discussing the subject had been afforded. For his own part; he never heard a word about it until just now.
The Bishop of Salisburywould prefer the repeal of the whole Act, and if the present anomalous state of things were allowed to continue, he was afraid many remedies would have to be proposed.
The Bishop of Exetersaid, that if the Crown recommended the appointment of one of the present Canons residentiary, the matter would be brought to an instant conclusion.
§ Debate adjourned.