The Earl of Wicklow, on presenting a Petition for the better observance of the Sabbath from a place in Ireland, said, that the petitioners alluded to Sunday Cabinet Communes and Cabinet Dinners, and prayed that these might be discontinued; and also that the Park-gates might be shut on a Sunday. With the last portion 473 of the prayer of this petition it was utterly impossible for him to concur, believing, as he did, that to shut the Park-gates on a Sunday would be an act of great cruelty to the labouring man, who could not enjoy a walk in the Parks upon any other day. But as to the Cabinet Councils and Dinners, he thought it would be advantageous to dispense with these practices. There was a strong feeling in the country on the subject of the observance of the Sabbath, and he thought that some measure must be adopted with regard to it. At the same time he declared, that he should wish to see that subject taken up by the Government rather than left to the canting hypocritical puritans of the day.
The Lord Chancellorsaid, that the mode of keeping the Sabbath was naturally a subject of some interest, and it was not to be wondered at, that people might wish to see the Sabbath more rigidly observed. There was nothing that man did that was incapable of improvement, and so far as that went, he was one of those who desired the better observance of the Sabbath; but wishing the better observance implied, that the present observance of it was to a certain extent good, for if he was to understand by that term, that the Sabbath was not better kept now than it had formerly been, he begged leave distinctly to deny the proposition. He remembered about twenty-five or thirty years ago, in going to his chambers upon a Sunday morning, which he was sorry to say, lawyers were often compelled—absolutely compelled to do—he had constantly witnessed scenes of the utmost dissoluteness and profligacy. There were no such sights now. Indeed, he knew of no capital in the world—and he had been in most of the capitals of Europe—at least, he knew of no European capital out of Scotland in which the Sabbath was so well kept as in this country. He said no capital out of Scotland, and he made Scotland an exception, for there certainly the Sabbath was more strictly kept than anywhere else; but that was from national habit, rather than from greater purity or more religious character; for he would not arrogate for them that praise. With regard to the part of the petition which related to Cabinet Dinners, it was a mistake to petition against Cabinet Dinners on a Sunday. He believed there never was one. He had never seen or heard of one, 474 He did not deny that there were Cabinet Councils on a Sunday; and they could not, by any possibility, be always avoided. Despatches often came on the Saturday night or the Sunday morning; they could not control all Europe; they would not have our Secretary of State answer despatches without consulting his colleagues, nor would it be expedient to answer them without discussion as to their contents. This was not a work of pleasure, but of necessity, and would be so as long as men were men. If it was a work of necessity, it was justifiable. But this observation was not confined to the duties of Cabinet Ministers. Consultations were held by lawyers upon a Sunday—by the most pious and religious lawyers—and he knew of no more pious and religious men than were to be found among the heads of the law. He recollected very well, that the father of the present right hon. Vice-Chancellor was once going to hold a consultation at his chambers on a Sunday. When his going was objected to by some person of some sex or other, and he was asked why he went upon a Sunday morning?—his answer was, "Why, some asses of mine have fallen into a pit, and I am going to try to get them out," as he might do on the authority of Scripture. "It may be partly my fault that they have fallen in, but they have fallen in, and I am going to try to get them out. I am going upon a work of peace, and a charitable work;" and so it was. This could not be put an end to, unless they could add one-seventh to the year, which they could not do; and if they shut up Cabinet Councils on a Sunday, they must not only expose the country to inconvenience, and, perhaps, to danger, but they must resolve upon shutting up the Court of Chancery on Monday, for the Lord Chancellor was always expected to be present at Cabinet Councils. It was his duty to be present at them, and he always was present, unless by some rare and inevitable accident. Much of the clamour upon this subject arose from ignorance, and from ignorant men suffering themselves to be made the tools of the mischievous; and he must express a decided opinion, that any measure of this sort, unless it was most judiciously framed and limited, and taken into consideration, would do more harm than good as to the object it had in view. It would make the Sabbath an unpopular institution; instead of being, as it was 475 now, when it was kept well, the poor man's day of rest, and the rich man's day of devotion.
The Bishop of Londonregretted, that this discussion should have arisen at the present moment, as he thought it would be of disservice to a cause, the progress of which to final success was essential to the cause of religion in this country. He did not dispute the position laid down by the noble and learned Lord; for, in the evidence which he had given before a Committee of the other House of Parliament, he (the Bishop of London) had said nearly the same thing. The position, that the Sabbath was better observed at this time, than it had been some years ago—at least among certain classes of people—he admitted; but there was a large class of society that, at the present time, were peculiarly exposed to temptation upon this point. The scenes which the noble and learned Lord had said he had witnessed on going to his chambers upon a Sunday morning, were certainly no longer witnessed upon the same spot; but they were transferred to other places in the metropolis; and if the noble and learned Lord visited St. George's Fields, Lambeth, or the north-eastern parts of the metropolis, he would see the desecration of the Sabbath carried to an extent such as to be alarming, not only to the friends of religion, but to the supporters of good government and social order. This question had not been put upon its right footing. The subject matter of the petitions that had been poured in upon their Lordships (and more could be obtained, if necessary) had been for the protection of the poorer classes in that well-regulated observance of the Sabbath, which was as necessary to their temporal comfort as to their spiritual wants. The petition he had this evening presented from the publicans and other tradesmen of St. Luke's, Chelsea, was to that effect. He should not observe upon the subject of Cabinet Councils on a Sunday; but with respect to consultations held by the members of that most honourable profession, the law—and which were held because they would lose some portion of their pecuniary emoluments, if they did not hold them—he should only say, that it gave him great concern to see the subject treated as it had been by the noble and learned Lord.
§ The Conversation was dropped.