Lords Sitting of 2 February 1826

THE KING'S SPEECH ON OPENING THE SESSION.
This day the Session was opened by Commission. The place of Lord Chancellor Eldon was, in consequence of indisposition, supplied by lord Gifford. The other commissioners were the earls of Westmorland, Harrowby, and Shaftesbury. The deputy usher of the black rod having been ordered to require the attendance of the House of Commons, he withdrew. In a few minutes after, the Speaker, accompanied by a considerable number of members, having appeared at the bar, lord Gifford opened the session, with the following Speech to both Houses:—
"My Lords and Gentlemen,
"We are commanded by his Majesty to inform you, that his Majesty has seen with regret the embarrassment which has occurred in the pecuniary transactions of the country, since the close of the last session of parliament.
"This embarrassment did not arise from any political events, either at home or abroad: it was not produced by any unexpected demand upon the public resources; nor by the apprehension of any interruption to the general tranquillity.
"Some of the causes to which this evil must be attributed, lie without the reach of direct parliamentary interposition; nor can security against the recurrence of them be found, unless in the experience
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of the sufferings which they have occasioned.
"But, to a certain portion of this evil, correctives at least, if not effectual remedies, may be applied; and his Majesty relies upon your wisdom to devise such measures as may tend to protect both private and public interests against the like sudden and violent fluctuations, by placing on a more firm foundation the Currency and circulating Credit of the country.
"His Majesty continues to receive from his Allies, and generally from all Foreign princes and states, the strongest assurances of their friendly disposition towards his Majesty. His Majesty, on his part, is constant and unwearied in his endeavours to reconcile conflicting interests, and to recommend and cultivate peace both in the Old world and in the New.
"His Majesty commands us to inform you, that, in pursuance of this policy, his Majesty's mediation has been successfully employed in the conclusion of a treaty between the crowns of Portugal and Brazil, by which the relations of friendly intercourse, long interrupted between two kindred nations, have been restored; and the independence of the Brazilian empire has been formally acknowledged.
"His Majesty loses no opportunity of giving effect to the principles of trade and navigation, which have received the sanction of Parliament, and of establishing

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them as far as possible, by engagements with foreign powers.
"His Majesty has directed to be laid before you, a copy of a Convention, framed on these principles, which has recently been concluded between his Majesty and the king of France; and of a similar Convention, with the free Hanseatic cities of Lubec, Bremen, and Hamburgh.
"His Majesty has likewise directed to be laid before you a copy of a Treaty of Amity, Commerce, and Navigation, concluded between his Majesty and the Republic of Colombia, the ratifications of which have been exchanged since the close of the last Session. For the carrying into effect some of the stipulations of this treaty, his Majesty will have need of your assistance.
"His Majesty regrets that he has not to announce to you the termination of hostilities in India: but the operations of the last campaign, through the bravery of the forces of his Majesty, and of the East India Company, and the skill and per. severance of their commanders, have been attended with uniform success, and his Majesty trusts that a continuance of the name exertions may lead, at no distant period, to an honourable and satisfactory pacification.
"His Majesty's attention has been directed to the consideration of several measures, recommended in the last Session of Parliament, for improving the condition of Ireland.
"The industry of that part of the United Kingdom, his Majesty has the satisfaction of acquainting you, is in a course of gradual and general advancemhent—an advancement mainly to be attributed to that state of tranquillity which now happily prevails throughout all the provinces of Ireland.
"Gentlemen of the House of Commons.
"His Majesty has directed the estimates for the year to be prepared and laid before you.
"They have been framed with an anxious desire to avoid every Expenditure
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beyond what the necessary demands of the public service may require.
"His Majesty has the satisfaction of informing you, that the produce of the Revenue, in the last year, has fully justified the expectations entertained at the commencement of it.
"My Lords and Gentlemen,
"His Majesty deeply laments the injurious effects which the late pecuniary crisis must have entailed upon many branches of the commerce and manufactures of the United Kingdom.
"But his Majesty confidently believes that the temporary check which commerce and manufactures may at this moment experience, will, under the blessing of Divine Providence, neither impair the great sources of our wealth, nor impede the growth of national prosperity."
The Commons then withdrew. After which, the Speech being again read by lord Gifford, and also by the Clerk at the table,
The Earl of Verulamrose, to move an address to his Majesty, in reply to his most gracious Speech. The noble earl observed, that the Speech from the throne explained to their lordships the political situation of the country, and that it was usual for those who rose for the purpose of proposing to their lordships an address in reply to the royal Speech, to notice the principal topics which it embraced. He did not intend, however, to go into minute details. On all material points, the state of the nation afforded sufficient grounds for congratulation. Whatever unfavourable circumstances he had to notice, were of a temporary nature. He had no series of national calamities to deplore, no protracted war to lament. In general, he had only to call their lordships' attention to the fortunate situation of the country: but it was not to be expected that there would be no disagreeable feature in the picture. "Man is born to trouble as the sparks fly upwards;" and their lordships were aware that every state of things was liable to uncertainty and change. Accordingly, the first topic of the Speech, related to the late extraordinary and unexpected panic, which had occurred in the pecuniary transactions of the country. It was the more unexpected, because it had occurred at a moment when the

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prosperity of the country appeared at its height, and when money abounded to an uncommon extent. This singular embarrassment had not, as was observed in the King's Speech, its origin in any political events. It seemed easy to obtain money for any purpose, and the most extravagant speculations were entered into. He believed it was the difficulty which capitalists experienced in obtaining an adequate interest for their money, which had led to the wild speculations which had taken place—speculations so wild, that it seemed as if the persons engaged in them were indifferent whether they should sink or swim. This over-speculation was the main cause of the distress which had been felt in the commercial world; but it was one which would cure itself, and which, therefore, ought not to be the object of parliamentary interposition. For the consideration of other circumstances connected with the late pecuniary embarrassments, opportunities would arise, and he was confident the evils were not irremediable. His Majesty stated, that he relied upon parliament for the adoption of measures calculated to protect the public against sudden and violent fluctuations; and he hoped their lordships would soon proceed to the consideration of the important subject. The way in which the panic had been met by merchants, bankers, and individuals of property, was a circumstance of great congratulation, and must induce their lordships to turn their attention to the great object recommended by his Majesty; namely, the placing the credit of the country on a more firm foundation. It was to be hoped that adventurers and speculators would take, warning from the past, and in future be guided by wisdom and moderation in their schemes. Their lordships would perceive from his Majesty's Speech that the termination of hostilities in India could not be announced. The war in that quarter of the world had been undertaken to maintain the national character. The military operations had hitherto been attended with success. The war had not for its object any extension of our empire in India; its only purpose was to obtain a secure and honourable peace. Their lordships would readily concur with him in congratulating his Majesty on another part of his Speech, which related to foreign affairs. He alluded to that part
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in which his Majesty informed parliament, that he continued to receive from his allies, and generally from all foreign powers, assurances of a friendly disposition. The noble earl concluded by calling their lordships' attention to the last paragraph of his Majesty's Speech, which, he said, stated his own sentiments with respect to the late embarrassments, in the conviction it expressed, that the temporary check which our commerce and manufactures might at this moment experience would, under the blessing of Divine Providence, neither impair the great sources of our wealth, nor impede the growth of national prosperity. He then moved an Address, which was, as usual, an echo of the Speech from the throne.
Lord Sheffield,in rising to second the Address, said it was not necessary for him to trespass on their lordships' indulgence at any great length, after the able manner in which his noble friend had brought forward the motion. He must, however, beg leave to make a few observations. It appeared to him, that the late pecuniary distress had arisen out of the peace and prosperity of the country, which, by creating a great accumulation of capital, induced persons to speculate to excess. The distress, however, was by no means general, and he congratulated their lordships that in all the manufacturing districts the spirit of combination among the working classes had entirely disappeared, and they had now returned to their usual habits of peaceful industry. He also congratulated their lordships, that the agricultural interest had met with no material cheek by the recent difficulties. Among the topics contained in the Speech there were many on which he might congratulate their lordships in common with his noble friend. It was highly gratifying to find that Colombia had finally established her independence, and that we had entered into friendly relations with that state, as well as with others in the same hemisphere. As to the war in India, it was well known that the principles on which it was carried on were sanctioned by the highest authorities in this country. With respect to that part of the Speech which adverted to the improved state of Ireland, he rejoiced to find that the measures introduced last session had been found effectual in reference to the administration of justice, education, and general

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improvement. The best proof of the efficacy of those measures was to be found in the tranquillity that now prevailed throughout every part of Ireland. Having thus briefly expressed his sentiments, he should sit down in the confident hope that their lordships would not hesitate to agree to the Address.
Lord Kingsaid, that the noble mover and seconder of the Address had both mentioned the present embarrassments, but he did not find that either of them had said a word on the causes which led to them. He would endeavour to supply the omission. The causes were, in some degree, to be attributed to the government; in a greater degree, to the country banks; and in a still greater degree to the Bank of England monopoly. He would tell their lordships how the government caused this mischief. It had prolonged the existence of the one and two pound notes. It had passed a law to allow of country banks issuing them. The measure permitting this was the measure of ministers. As far as the present evil arose from the bankers issuing such notes, to this degree it had been caused by his Majesty's government. There was also a strong tendency in the measures of ministers to reduce the rate of interest; and for this purpose, the one and two pound note bill had been passed. They had reduced the rate of interest on Exchequer bills, in order to promote a great future reduction of interest. Their conduct reminded him of the memorable speech of a memorable ex-chancellor of the Exchequer, in which that noble lord had stated, that it would be no benefit, if every individual, when he awoke in the morning, found a guinea in his pocket; but it would be a great benefit if he found the rate of interest reduced when he awoke. Such was the sentiment of the accredited organ of government, and ministers now seemed to think that it was no benefit that wealth should be spread abroad amongst all the people, but a great benefit that it should be collected into heaps. The ex-chancellor would be a proper organ for the projectors of last year, who removed the useless guinea out of the people's pocket, and supplied its place by receipts for stock or scrip for loans. He would recommend the people, as the proper use of such paper, to subscribe it to build a monument to this ex-chancellor of the Exchequer. He had said, that the Bank of England had contributed to the dis-
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tress; and he did not know any period of distress for the last thirty or fifty years, in which the conduct of that establishment had not been injurious. Let their lordships look back, and they would find that the conduct of the Bank of England had, in every case, aggravated the distress by its conduct. It was a most faulty machine. It was impossible that a Bank so incorporated could do good. If their lordships were to set about erecting an establishment to do mischief, they would erect it on the very principles which governed that corporation; they would give it a monopoly, remove from it all fear of rivalry, and they would connect it with the government. The directors had no interest in the profit or loss of the concern; they had neither hopes nor fears for the result of their conduct; they had no interest in managing it well, but they had a strong interest in mismanaging it. The machine was altogether too vast to be well conducted; and this appeared to him one of the strongest reasons which could be urged for putting an end to the monopoly. The Bank, it might be supposed, had not produced the late crisis; but he contended that it was art and part in the whole. It had increased the issues of Bank notes at the beginning of last year. He did not say this on his own authority, but on the authority of the best-informed merchants in the city of London. Mr. Tooke had stated, in a book which well deserved their lordships' attention, that the issues of the Bank of England amounted, in April, 1823, to 17,750,473 l.; in April, 1824,19,011,575 l.; and in April, 1825, to 20,881,123 l. This was a very considerable increase, amounting, as stated by Mr. Tooke, in the year 1825, to an increase, in the Bank circulation, of three millions, as compared with the issue of 1823. He could not better express the effect this had had on the country than in the words of the author—" Speculative operations, embracing so many commodities of great importance, in point of amount, necessarily created a large mass of paper, and of transactions on" mere credit, thus adding to a circulation already swelled by the increase of country bank notes. Such were the circumstances under which the Bank of England issued, and for some months maintained in circulation, an increased amount of its notes. Although this increased issue by the Bank did not alone cause the great additional excite-

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ment of the spirit of speculation which followed it, yet it gave a fresh and powerful stimulant to that spirit, and assisted in converting incipient delusion into absolute insanity." The noble earl opposite was willing, he believed, to control the conduct of the Bank, but he had found the Bank too strong for him. The noble earl also had been willing to prevent the issue of the one and two pound Bank notes, but he had found the country bankers and the country gentlemen too strong for him. They wanted these notes to keep up prices and encourage speculation. The noble earl was not strong enough for these gentlemen; and he was afraid he would not be strong enough to carry the measure which he had talked of last session for revising the Corn laws. The noble earl had then stated distinctly, that he meant, this session, to revise the Corn laws; and he should like to know if he really meant to do any thing on the subject of those laws? [The earl of Liverpool stated, across the table, that he would answer that question by and by]. He was afraid, from the looks of the noble earl, that nothing was to be done this session with the Corn laws. The noble earl was probably afraid of again meeting with such a signal defeat as he had met with last year on the Canada Corn bill. That defeat was a disgrace which could never be wiped out. The measure was a measure of government; it had passed the Commons, and was brought up to their lordships. Then came down a noble earl to oppose it. The noble earl opposite had implored him to allow it to pass for a year and a half. No; it could not be. For a year, then; and a year was granted to the government. This was the most disgraceful proceeding he had ever witnessed. Let their lordships only suppose a lord A, or a lord B, opposing a ministerial measure brought up from the other House, under the ministry of Mr. Pitt orlord Grenville; —the thing was impossible. It reminded him of Charles 2nd complaining to the Dutch ambassador, that his government was not treated with the same respect by the Dutch as that of Cromwell:—"Your majesty must recollect," replied the ambassador, "that Cromwell was a very different sort of a man." So, if the ministers were to remind noble lords of the way in which they conducted themselves towards Mr. Pitt or lord Grenville, the reply might be, "but you are very dif-
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ferent sort of men." He feared the country could have no hopes of seeing any alteration in the Corn laws this session. If that were so, he was persuaded that nothing but discussion, repeated discussion, could produce any good; and he was resolved on every occasion to express his opinion on this most detestable law. It was the most gigantic job ever practised. It was difficult to say which was greatest, the unfeeling avarice which suggested it, or the bold impudence which stated that it was for the public good. It was the most enormous job ever heard of in the whole history of misrule. The West India job only made us pay more for our sugar. The East India job, when Leadenhall-street was in the fulness of its power, and monopolized all the trade beyond the Cape of Good Hope, without a rival, was in comparison nothing to the job of the Corn laws. Many references had of late been made to that branch of the legitimate house of Bourbon which ruled in Spain, and which had been held up as the most foolish of all God's vicegerents on earth; but what had they done equal in folly to our Corn laws? They had given to one man the monopoly of the trade of Buenos Ayres; they might have given to one city the monopoly of all the trade of Mexico and Peru, but the Spanish monarchs, who were held up as a sort of scare-crows to bad governments, and were of more use dead than living, had granted no monopoly half so monstrous or half so mischievous as the monopoly of food. This was a job of the landed interest; and he would repeat, that it was the most gigantic job to be found in the whole history of misrule. It was not possible the Corn laws should be continued. Both justice and policy required their repeal. He believed that to be the only assembly on the face of the earth in which it was necessary to prove the advantages of cheap food. Their lordships were sharp-sighted enough on some occasions, and had speedily perceived the necessity of a law to punish those who broke machines. But why were the breakers of machines to be put down? because machines saved labour. All our wealth, all our productive power, depended on the employment of machines; and if they were valuable, how was it that cheap food was an injury? If food was cheap, labour was cheap. But the Corn laws compelled us to have recourse

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to more labour to produce food. This must be the case while we were obliged to cultivate bad soils, when we might obtain food from good soils; and the Corn laws ought to be put down like machine breakers. It was stated by some that the difference of prices was so great upon the continent, as compared with this country, that ruin must be the consequence of allowing an unrestricted importation to take place. But he would deny the fact. If they could show him that there was a considerable difference in the prices, which he did not believe, then he would say, that in proportion as the landholder gained, the consumer lost, and that by persisting in restrictive measures, in order to keep up the price, they proclaimed their own avarice and injustice. Their lordships were all aware, that that celebrated voyager, Mr. Lemuel Gulliver, on giving an account of that august assembly to the king of Brogdignag, had told him that they were always occupied for the good of the country. Now if, instead of such an account he had informed him that they were always occupied in contriving to keep up the price of corn, then indeed his majesty's answer would have been a just one, when he observed, that we were the most contemptible race of little reptiles, and our rulers the most selfish and unjust. As to the prosperity of the country, he believed the one thing needful with respect to it was a revision of the Corn laws. Indeed, he felt the conviction of its necessity so strongly, that he felt himself bound to move an amendment, expressive of an opinion to that effect. His lordship, accordingly, concluded with an Amendment, pledging the House to take into consideration, at an early period, the propriety of revising the Corn laws, as the best means of securing the prosperity of the country.
Earl Grosvenorsaid, that although the subject was one of the utmost importance, still he was not at present prepared to go so far as his noble friend who spoke last. However desirable it might be to agitate the question at some future period, he could not at present support the amendment. His object in rising was, to say a few words in reference to the Speech from the throne. He must, however, premise, that he felt much regret that his Majesty was not able to attend in person, for the purpose of opening the session. He feared the circumstance
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arose from indisposition; if so, he should greatly regret it. It could not, however, have been very agreeable to his Majesty, to deliver a Speech, which necessarily made allusion to a state of things, not the most agreeable. It certainly was very different from those which they had been of late years in the habit of hearing. Enough, however, was held out to encourage hope, and there were some points touched upon with an expression of satisfaction. Indeed, there was generally upon such occasions too great a disposition to introduce topics of congratulation, in place of pointing out the real state of the country. Such a speech as that which their lordships had just heard from the throne, was much more creditable to ministers, than one of empty congratulation. There were some points in it to which he was desirous to advert. In the first place, his Majesty recommended that the circulating currency of the country should be placed on a more firm foundation. Now, he could not see how-it could be put on a more firm foundation than that on which, by law, it stood at present. They were thus led to believe, that some legislative measure was to be introduced on the subject, or something done towards relieving the present distresses. It would be highly satisfactory if they were made acquainted with the nature of the measures which ministers had in contemplation. There was another point to which he must advert. His Majesty informed them, that the revenue fully justified the expectations that were formed of it last session. This, as it appeared to him, required some explanation. All they knew at present was, that there was an actual deficiency of revenue in the present year, as compared with the last. How, then, was the passage in his Majesty's Speech to be explained? Perhaps ministers did not anticipate a larger revenue than that actually received, and would account for the deficiency by the duties that had been taken off last session; or perhaps, having foreseen the difficulties that had arisen in the money market, they, in consequence, calculated upon some deficiency in the revenue. He saw no other means in which the passage in the Speech could be explained. The impression on his mind, produced by all that had lately taken place, was, that to relieve the country from its difficulties, they must have recourse to that economical system which he had for so many

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years been ineffectually recommending. Whether the present embarrassments arose from over-trading, an over-issue of paper, or any other cause, he knew not; but of this there was no doubt, that the revenue had decreased. The same causes might recur again, and the same consequence follow. The only way of guarding against such an inconvenience was by a system of retrenchment and economy. By no other means could the country ever hope to see an efficient sinking fund. Had they commenced upon a principle of retrenchment ten years back, and acted upon it steadily, how different would the state of the country now be! Instead of a sinking fund of 5,000,000 l., it might have been eight, ten, or even twelve millions; and thus would not only a great part of the interest of the public debt have been got rid of, but a considerable part of the principal. There was not a single branch of their expenditure in which retrenchment should not have been introduced long ago; but the largest reductions should have been made in the standing army. There was no reason on earth, why the army should not have been greatly reduced, as had been the case on the termination of all former wars. This was also most important in a constitutional point of view. What was this large army wanted for? At one time, the cause assigned was the existence of a party called the radicals. But, did their lordships not recollect the events that took place at Manchester? There a more numerous body than had, perhaps, ever assembled upon any former occasion, met together. They created considerable alarm; but, formidable as they appeared, they were dispersed by a handful of yeomanry. Was not this a sufficient proof that the peace of the country might be preserved without such a large and unconstitutional army as the country was called upon to support? Had we husbanded our resources, how much better able should we now be to meet the expenses of the disastrous war in India. He did not know to whose counsels that war was to be attributed, but this he would say, that they had much to answer for, unless they could shew clearly, that it was founded on necessity and justice. Then, with regard to Ireland. Those had much to answer for who refused to concur in a measure which would have effectually secured the peace of that unhappy country, and rendered a large military force
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unnecessary. How was it possible, while the great bulk of the population were kept in their present state of exclusion, that there could be tranquillity or content? He rejoiced, however, at the prospect of any measures that might tend to better the condition of that country. But, nothing could be permanently advantageous, until the Catholics participated in all the constitutional privileges of their fellow subjects. This being once done, they might safely draw off the immense standing army which they now found it necessary to maintain for the purpose of overawing the people. Though not prepared to support the amendment of his noble friend, he had felt it his duty to throw out these few observations.
Lord Teynhamsaid, he should oppose the amendment. With respect to the Corn laws, it should be recollected that the country was at present in an artificial state; that we were subject to an enormous taxation; and that while such was the case, it was not to be expected that the grower of corn here could compete with the foreign grower upon any thing like equal terms. The agricultural interest had been always anxious to lighten the distresses of the other classes of the community. The difficulties of the present time did not arise from the corn laws, but were mainly to be attributed to that spirit of ruinous speculation which had unfortunately taken possession of the country. He did not see how the present military establishment could be reduced, consistently with the best interests of the country. He trusted that, in conformity with the suggestion thrown out in the Speech from the throne, such measures would be adopted as would prevent the recurrence of the difficulties which had lately been experienced in the money-market.
The Marquis of Lansdownsaid, he did not rise for the purpose of at present discussing the unfortunate topic which formed so prominent a part of the Speech from the throne, for it would be impossible for the House to enter upon that topic, without having received any information respecting the nature of the views and intentions of his Majesty's government. It was a subject upon which he could not say any thing, without saying a great deal; he would not, therefore, now attempt to inquire how far that measure would be obliged to receive re-consideration, which authorized the issuing of 1l. and2 l. notes;

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how far the present embarrassments were owing to that measure, to the other laws relating to banks, and to the monopoly of the Bank of England; or how far any of these causes had produced the evil now admitted to exist. All he meant to do at present was, to claim a complete reserve on the part of himself and of the House, as to their opinion respecting the possibility of the application of any corrective, or of that in particular which seemed to be contemplated by the king's government. He did not even wish to call on the noble earl opposite to state more particularly at present the nature of his proposed corrective, because he did not think that the address pledged the House to any thing upon that subject. The case was the same with respect to the Corn laws. Not that he did not think it would be incumbent on their lordships, and the members of the other House of parliament, to express their distinct opinion upon these subjects; but that they were not called on to do so in the absence of that information which he believed his majesty's government had been endeavouring to procure. The same observation applied to the state of the currency, as well as of prices in this country, because he believed it would be impossible to separate these questions from each other, and also from the question of free trade. Having said this, he trusted he had said enough to preclude himself, and he hoped others, from entering upon the discussion of these topics at present, leaving it to the noble earl, if so disposed, but not at all pressing him, to state more particularly the nature of his intentions upon the subject; and also whether he had any measure in view respecting the state of Ireland.
The Earl of Liverpoolsaid, that he did not feel himself warranted in intruding on the attention of the House for the purpose of entering into a discussion upon the several very important topics which naturally grew out of the Speech from the throne, and which undoubtedly involved questions of the greatest political interest. After the statement made by the noble marquis, be certainly did not conceive himself called upon to enter upon the consideration of those important points on the present occasion. At the same time he considered it necessary, with respect to a question of so much political interest, that he should use no reserve—not as to details, for it would be impossible to treat of them with effect at that moment—but
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as to the general nature of the measures which it might be the disposition of government to propose. He would therefore trouble their lordships with a very short statement. In the first place, however, he would call their attention to this circumstance, that the convulsions in the pecuniary transactions of the country were not unexpected by him or by other members of his majesty's government. Their lordships might recollect that in March last, he would not say he took, he created almost, an occasion of stating to their lordships what, sooner or later, would be the effect of the rash spirit of speculation which then existed in the country, and of giving notice, in a few words, to their lordships and the country, that if the consequences which he predicted did arise, the relief which had been applied on former occasions would not again be applied to meet the new evil. He had given that warning, in anticipation of what was to come. He had told those persons who, by rash speculation, might become involved in distress and ruin, that they must abide by the consequences of their own acts, and that they would have no right to expect from government and parliament that relief which had been afforded on some former occasions. A noble baron had adverted to what he conceived to be the causes of the recent events. When the proper opportunity arrived, he would not be disposed to avoid discussion on that point. There was one cause, however, so prominent and so great in magnitude, that even if he were disposed to allow that other circumstances might have acted in the way of aggravation, yet this cause was so complete in itself, that it was sufficient to account for all that had happened. Their lordships knew the general spirit of mad speculation which had prevailed in the country during the last two years, and they would at the same time recollect his having stated, on the occasion to which he had before referred, that that spirit was not confined to the metropolis alone, but was extending itself all over the country through the medium of the country banks. It must be evident that, from the peculiar nature of the circulation of country bank notes, it was extremely difficult to state precisely what was the amount of that circulation at any particular period. But there was a document which showed the progressive state of the country banks' circulation with sufficient accuracy to serve the purposes of general reasoning. All

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country bank notes required to be stamped; and therefore parliament had it in its power to call for a return of the number stamped for each banker. Now, it appeared from a return, which would be laid on their lordships' table, that in the years 1821, 1822, and 1823, the average number of notes stamped in each year was four millions and one or two hundred thousand. He spoke of their value, not of their numerical amount. The difference between particular years within that period, never amounted to more than one or two hundred thousand pounds—a difference which might easily be accounted for by incidental circumstances. In 1824, when the spirit of mad speculation to which he had referred first began to prevail, the amount of country bank notes increased to about 6,000,000 l.; and, in 1825, it increased to more than 8,000,000 l., being double what it was in 1821, 1822, and 1823. Was it not sufficient to state that fact to their lordships, to account completely for all the evil effects of over-trading and rash speculation upon the general interests of the country? He did not deny that, during the same period, there had been some increase of the Bank of England paper; but it bore no proportion whatever to the increase in the general circulation of the country banks. The noble lord who commenced the debate had accused ministers of having participated in causing the existing embarrassments, by endeavouring to lower the rate of interest. If ministers had introduced any forced measures which could operate to lower the rate of interest, such conduct would have been highly blameable; but he denied that ministers had done any thing of the kind. What were the facts? There was a rise in the price of public securities, and a lower rate of interest, the consequences of continued peace and the prosperous state of the country. Government would have been highly reproachable, if they had not taken advantage of those favourable circumstances, in order to reduce the burthens of the people. By the measures which they adopted, they had been able to take off 1,800,000 l. of taxes, and to reduce the interest of the national debt, in the first instance to the extent of 1,400,000 l. and subsequently of 150,000 l. a year.—He had very shortly stated these points, because he might have occasion hereafter to go more into detail, when it would be his duty to endeavour, in some degree, to point out a remedy for the present state
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of things. He agreed with that part of his Majesty's Speech which stated, that for the effects of over-trading, and rash speculation growing out of the prosperity of the country, no cure could be found in legislation, and that it was only to be found in individuals having a due sense of the danger and inconvenience to which they exposed themselves by such acts. But, he likewise concurred with the declaration in the royal Speech, that correctives and palliatives might and ought to be applied for the present distress. It was no fault of his noble friend near him (lord Bexley) nor of himself, that the measures which it was the intention of ministers to bring under the consideration of parliament had not been before adopted. He would give their lordships a short description of them. The measures which would be brought forward were not new. They had, on former occasions, been brought under consideration. From what causes they had failed, was a question which it was not necessary to discuss. It was sufficient for him to show, that they were not new ideas, drawn out for the first time by present circumstances. The putting of some check, in one way or other, on the issue of small notes, was a plan suggested by his noble friend. So likewise was an arrangement with the Bank of England, having for its object to alter the situation in which that establishment stood with the public. He had no difficulty in stating what it was intended to propose on the present occasion. Indeed, he thought it better that no uncertainty should prevail on the subject; for it frequently did more mischief than a full knowledge of the general purport of the measures which government meant to adopt. He had therefore no difficulty in stating, that one of the measures which government intended to submit for the consideration of parliament, was a regulation, by which one and two pound Bank-notes would be gradually withdrawn from circulation, and a metallic currency substituted for them. Another measure which government would propose had become of essential importance to the interests of the country. He did not mean to join in the reflection which the noble baron had cast upon the Bank of England; but he was perfectly satisfied—and he had entertained the conviction for years—that the country had grown too large, that its concerns had become too extensive, to allow of the exclusive privilege of the Bank of England.

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The privilege of the Bank might have been highly useful in the early period of our commercial transactions; but the country was now too large for any one such exclusive establishment. The Bank of England's privilege operated in a most extraordinary and, he thought, a most unfortunate manner for the country. Any small tradesman, a cheesemonger, a butcher, or a shoemaker, might open a country bank; but a set of persons with a fortune sufficient to carry on the concern with security were not permitted to do so. He was old enough to remember the time when there was scarcely such an institution as a country bank, except in great commercial towns, and when the transactions of the country were carried on in Bank of England notes, and money obtained from London. But now, when such a mode of conducting the transactions of the country was no longer practicable, it ought to be the policy of parliament to place all country banks on a solid foundation, and to amend a state of law which he would not say allowed of the establishment only of banks which were not solid, because he believed the greater proportion of the country banks were substantial, but which certainly prevented the establishment of those which, from the nature of their constitution, must be most solid. It was, however, necessary to deal with the existing charter of the Bank of England, which would not expire till 1833. But, if the Bank could be induced to give up so much of their exclusive privilege as related to country banks, and if they would accompany that surrender with a measure which would be desirable for their own sakes; namely, the establishment, in some parts of the country, of branches of their own institution—the effect on the general circulation of the country would, he thought, be most beneficial. Such was the general nature of the measure which government would feel it necessary to propose at the present moment. He had considered it better to make this general statement, than to leave the intentions of government involved in obscurity or doubt. He did not mean to say that there were no difficulties to be contended with. The whole question must be the subject of discussion hereafter. To enter upon that discussion at the present moment would be improper. With respect to the question put to him by the noble baron, on the subject of the Corn laws, he had no difficulty in repeating what
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he had stated last session; namely, that his opinion was, that sooner or later it would be highly desirable to revise the general system of the Corn laws. There were, however, a variety of circumstances to be taken into consideration. He had no difficulty in stating, that it was not his intention, nor that of any member of his majesty's government, to bring forward any proposition with regard to the general question during the present session. He saw no circumstances connected with the present situation of the country, which rendered it the imperative duty of government to bring that question under the immediate consideration of parliament. He had spoken particularly of the general question; because, a detached measure with respect to Canada corn, which was passed last year, and would expire in 1827, it might be necessary to re-consider in the course of the present or of the next session. Upon the point, whether it would be expedient to review that particular measure during the present session, he would reserve himself; but he wished it to be distinctly understood, that government did not consider it necessary to bring forward the general question during the present session. A noble lord had alluded to the absence of his Majesty. He was at a loss to imagine what could be the noble lord's object in introducing such a topic. He had, however, no objection to state, that his Majesty's absence was owing to indisposition alone.
The Earl of Carnarvondoubted whether the gradual withdrawal of the 1l. and 2l. Bank notes would have all the beneficial effect which the noble earl anticipated from the measure. He greatly feared that the prosperity of the country, during the last two or three years, had rested upon a fallacious foundation. He apprehended that the apparent prosperity had partly arisen from the measure which authorised the circulation of small notes. That measure had produced good in the first instance, and evil afterwards. He had never concurred with the opinion which many had entertained of the difficulties of the country having terminated with the resumption of cash payments. It was impossible to pay in gold a debt contracted in paper. He hoped that parliament would take the whole of the question into its consideration, and not confine its attention to particular branches. He supposed it was intended to place country banks generally on the same footing with

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those in the northern part of the island. Previous to the last war, the greatest portion of the currency of those banks was paper. Under that currency Scotland had flourished, and had not experienced those convulsions which this part of the country had felt under the restrictive system. It was therefore highly desirable that parliament should consider the question in all its parts, and establish a permanent system instead of constantly changing its measures. The Speech from the throne held forth the prospect of years of continued peace. He hoped that those years would be occupied in establishing the internal condition of the country on a permanent foundation. If any alteration was to be made in the currency, it had better be effected at once, than gradually. A graduated system was proposed in 1819, and their lordships knew that it had been productive of no benefit. The temporizing measures adopted with respect to the silk-manufacture, had greatly aggravated, if not entirely caused, the distress under which that trade was at present suffering. The introduction of foreign silks was postponed for two years; and the consequence was, that the manufacturers entered into extensive speculations, and over-stocked the market during the period allowed for the continuance of their monopoly. If they had been allowed only a few months to dispose of their stock on hand, the existing distress would not have prevailed.
The Earl of Lauderdalesaid, that from the time he had first thought upon the subject, he had always been of opinion that a paper currency, convertible into gold on demand, was that which was best adapted for the transaction of the business of a country. A currency of that decription at present existed in this country. He challenged any of their lordships to state an instance, since the resumption of cash payments, in which gold had not been given in exchange for paper when demanded. In his opinion it was not to the currency that it was necessary to look for the origin of the existing embarrassments. In the course of the last year there had been a demand on the capital and labour of the country, to the extent of 17,000,000 l. Let any man consider whether the country was capable of answering that demand. The distress which was caused at the commencement of the late war, by the raising of a loan of only four millions, was nearly as great as that which at present existed. Could the pre-
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sent state of the country, then, be matter of surprise, when a demand was made on its labour and capital to the amount of seventeen millions? The noble earl had read a statement of the increased issues of country bank-notes for the last year or two; but if he wished to account for the embarrassments of the country, he had better analyse the number and qualities of the Steam and Mining, and other joint-stock companies which had recently been formed, and the quantity of capital which had been sunk in these speculations. At all events, if it was intended to restrict the circulation of one and two pound notes, he hoped that such a restriction would not be extended to Scotland.
The Amendment was negatived, and the Address agreed to without a division.