§ Motion made, and Question put forthwith pursuant to Standing Order No. 101(5)(Standing Committees on Statutory Instruments, &c.)
§
That the draft Electricity Generators (Rateable Values)(Scotland) Order 1993, which was laid before this House on 15th February, be approved.—[Mr. Patnick ]
§ The House divided: Ayes 295, Noes 58.
1002| Division No. 181] | [7.14 pm |
| AYES | |
| Adley, Robert | Clifton-Brown, Geoffrey |
| Ainsworth, Peter (East Surrey) | Coe, Sebastian |
| Aitken, Jonathan | Colvin, Michael |
| Alexander, Richard | Conway, Derek |
| Alison, Rt Hon Michael (Selby) | Coombs, Anthony (Wyre For'st) |
| Alton, David | Coombs, Simon (Swindon) |
| Amess, David | Cope, Rt Hon Sir John |
| Ancram, Michael | Couchman, James |
| Arbuthnot, James | Cran, James |
| Arnold, Jacques (Gravesham) | Currie, Mrs Edwina (S D'by'ire) |
| Arnold. Sir Thomas (Hazel Grv) | Curry, David (Skipton & Ripon) |
| Ashby, David | Davies, Quentin (Stamford) |
| Aspinwall, Jack | Davis, David (Boothferry) |
| Atkinson, David (Bour'mouth E) | Day, Stephen |
| Atkinson, Peter (Hexham) | Deva, Nirj Joseph |
| Baker, Nicholas (Dorset North) | Devlin, Tim |
| Baldry, Tony | Dorrell, Stephen |
| Banks, Robert (Harrogate) | Douglas-Hamilton, Lord James |
| Bates, Michael | Dover, Den |
| Beggs, Roy | Duncan, Alan |
| Beith, Rt Hon A. J. | Duncan-Smith, Iain |
| Bellingham, Henry | Dunn, Bob |
| Bendall, Vivian | Durant, Sir Anthony |
| Beresford, Sir Paul | Dykes, Hugh |
| Biffen, Rt Hon John | Eggar, Tim |
| Blackburn, Dr John G. | Elletson, Harold |
| Body, Sir Richard | Evans, David (Welwyn Hatfield) |
| Bonsor, Sir Nicholas | Evans, Jonathan (Brecon) |
| Booth, Hartley | Evans, Nigel (Ribble Valley) |
| Bowden, Andrew | Evennett, David |
| Bowis, John | Faber, David |
| Boyson, Rt Hon Sir Rhodes | Fabricant, Michael |
| Brandreth, Gyles | Fenner, Dame Peggy |
| Brazier, Julian | Field, Barry (Isle of Wight) |
| Bright, Graham | Fishburn, Dudley |
| Brooke, Rt Hon Peter | Forman, Nigel |
| Brown, M. (Brigg & Cl'thorpes) | Forsyth, Michael (Stirling) |
| Browning, Mrs. Angela | Forth, Eric |
| Bruce, Ian (S Dorset) | Fox, Sir Marcus (Shipley) |
| Budgen, Nicholas | Freeman, Roger |
| Burt, Alistair | French, Douglas |
| Butcher, John | Fry, Peter |
| Butler, Peter | Gale, Roger |
| Butterfill, John | Gallie, Phil |
| Campbell, Menzies (Fife NE) | Gardiner, Sir George |
| Carlile, Alexander (Montgomry) | Garel-Jones, Rt Hon Tristan |
| Carlisle, John (Luton North) | Garnier, Edward |
| Carlisle, Kenneth (Lincoln) | Gill, Christopher |
| Carrington, Matthew | Goodlad, Rt Hon Alastair |
| Carttiss, Michael | Goodson-Wickes, Dr Charles |
| Cash, William | Gorman, Mrs Teresa |
| Channon, Rt Hon Paul | Gorst, John |
| Churchill, Mr | Grant, Sir Anthony (Cambs SW) |
| Clappison, James | Greenway, Harry (Ealing N) |
| Clark, Dr Michael (Rochford) | Greenway, John (Ryedale) |
| Clarke, Rt Hon Kenneth (Ruclif) | Griffiths, Peter (Portsmouth, N) |
| Hague, William | Michie, Mrs Ray (Argyll Bute) |
| Hamilton, Rt Hon Archie (Epsom) | Milligan, Stephen |
| Hamilton, Neil (Tatton) | Mills, Iain |
| Hampson, Dr Keith | Mitchell, Andrew (Gedling) |
| Hanley, Jeremy | Moate, Sir Roger |
| Hannam, Sir John | Molyneaux, Rt Hon James |
| Hargreaves, Andrew | Monro, Sir Hector |
| Harris, David | Moss, Malcolm |
| Harvey, Nick | Needham, Richard |
| Haselhurst, Alan | Neubert, Sir Michael |
| Hawkins, Nick | Newton, Rt Hon Tony |
| Hawksley, Warren | Nicholls, Patrick |
| Hayes, Jerry | Nicholson, David (Taunton) |
| Heald, Oliver | Norris, Steve |
| Heath, Rt Hon Sir Edward | Onslow, Rt Hon Sir Cranley |
| Heathcoat-Amory, David | Oppenheim, Phillip |
| Hendry, Charles | Page, Richard |
| Heseltine, Rt Hon Michael | Paice, James |
| Higgins, Rt Hon Sir Terence L. | Patnick, Irvine |
| Hill, James (Southampton Test) | Patten, Rt Hon John |
| Hogg, Rt Hon Douglas (G'tham) | Pattie, Rt Hon Sir Geoffrey |
| Horam, John | Pawsey, James |
| Howarth, Alan (Strat'rd-on-A) | Peacock, Mrs Elizabeth |
| Howell, Rt Hon David (G'dford) | Pickles, Eric |
| Hughes, Simon (Southwark) | Porter, David (Waveney) |
| Hunt, Rt Hon David (Wirral W) | Portillo, Rt Hon Michael |
| Hunt, Sir John (Ravensbourne) | Rathbone, Tim |
| Hunter, Andrew | Redwood, John |
| Hurd, Rt Hon Douglas | Renton, Rt Hon Tim |
| Jack, Michael | Richards, Rod |
| Jessel, Toby | Riddick, Graham |
| Johnson Smith, Sir Geoffrey | Robathan, Andrew |
| Jones, Gwilym (Cardiff N) | Roberts, Rt Hon Sir Wyn |
| Jones, Nigel (Cheltenham) | Robertson, Raymond (Ab'd'n S) |
| Jones, Robert B. (W Hertfdshr) | Robinson, Mark (Somerton) |
| Jopling, Rt Hon Michael | Rowe, Andrew (Mid Kent) |
| Kellett-Bowman, Dame Elaine | Rumbold, Rt Hon Dame Angela |
| Kennedy, Charles (Ross,C&S) | Ryder, Rt Hon Richard |
| Key, Robert | Sackville, Tom |
| Kilfedder, Sir James | Sainsbury, Rt Hon Tim |
| King, Rt Hon Tom | Scott, Rt Hon Nicholas |
| Kirkhope, Timothy | Shaw, David (Dover) |
| Kirkwood, Archy | Shepherd, Richard (Aldridge) |
| Knapman, Roger | Shersby, Michael |
| Knight, Mrs Angela (Erewash) | Sims, Roger |
| Knight, Greg (Derby N) | Smith, Sir Dudley (Warwick) |
| Knight, Dame Jill (Bir'm E'st'n) | Smith, Tim (Beaconsfield) |
| Knox, David | Speed, Sir Keith |
| Kynoch, George (Kincardine) | Spencer, Sir Derek |
| Lait, Mrs Jacqui | Spicer, Sir James (W Dorset) |
| Legg, Barry | Spicer, Michael (S Worcs) |
| Leigh, Edward | Spink, Dr Robert |
| Lennox-Boyd, Mark | Spring, Richard |
| Lester, Jim (Broxtowe) | Sproat, Iain |
| Lidington, David | Squire, Robin (Hornchurch) |
| Lightbown, David | Steel, Rt Hon Sir David |
| Lilley, Rt Hon Peter | Steen, Anthony |
| Lloyd, Peter (Fareham) | Stephen, Michael |
| Lord, Michael | Stern, Michael |
| Luff, Peter | Stewart, Allan |
| Lyell, Rt Hon Sir Nicholas | Streeter, Gary |
| Lynne, Ms Liz | Sumberg, David |
| McCrea, Rev William | Sykes, John |
| MacGregor, Rt Hon John | Tapsell, Sir Peter |
| MacKay, Andrew | Taylor, Ian (Esher) |
| Maclean, David | Taylor, John M. (Solihull) |
| McNair-Wilson, Sir Patrick | Taylor, Matthew (Truro) |
| Madel, David | Taylor, Sir Teddy (Southend, E) |
| Maitland, Lady Olga | Thomason, Roy |
| Major, Rt Hon John | Thompson, Sir Donald (C'er V) |
| Malone, Gerald | Thompson, Patrick (Norwich N) |
| Mans, Keith | Thornton, Sir Malcolm |
| Marlow, Tony | Thurnham, Peter |
| Marshall, John (Hendon S) | Townend, John (Bridlington) |
| Marshall, Sir Michael (Arundel) | Townsend, Cyril D. (Bexl'yh'th) |
| Martin, David (Portsmouth S) | Tracey, Richard |
| Mawhinney, Dr Brian | Tredinnick, David |
| Mayhew, Rt Hon Sir Patrick | Trend, Michael |
| Mellor, Rt Hon David | Twinn, Dr Ian |
| Merchant, Piers | Tyler, Paul |
| Viggers, Peter | Widdecombe, Ann |
| Walden, George | Willetts, David |
| Walker, A. Cecil (Belfast N) | Wilshire, David |
| Walker, Bill (N Tayside) | Winterton, Mrs Ann (Congleton) |
| Waller, Gary | Winterton, Nicholas (Macc'f'ld) |
| Ward, John | Wolfson, Mark |
| Wardle, Charles (Bexhill) | Wood, Timothy |
| Waterson, Nigel | Yeo, Tim |
| Watts, John | Young, Sir George (Acton) |
| Wells, Bowen | |
| Wheeler, Rt Hon Sir John | Tellers for the Ayes: |
| Whitney, Ray | Mr. Sydney Chapman and |
| Whittingdale, John | Mr. Robert Hughes. |
| NOES | |
| Abbott, Ms Diane | Hutton, John |
| Allen, Graham | Jamieson, David |
| Austin-Walker, John | Janner, Greville |
| Barnes, Harry | Jones, Jon Owen (Cardiff C) |
| Benn, Rt Hon Tony | Lewis, Terry |
| Byers, Stephen | Loyden, Eddie |
| Callaghan, Jim | McMaster, Gordon |
| Campbell-Savours, D. N. | Madden, Max |
| Canavan, Dennis | Marshall, David (Shettleston) |
| Cann, Jamie | Martlew, Eric |
| Chisholm, Malcolm | Meale, Alan |
| Clark, Dr David (South Shields) | Milburn, Alan |
| Cohen, Harry | Mitchell, Austin (Gt Grimsby) |
| Corbyn, Jeremy | Morgan, Rhodri |
| Corston, Ms Jean | Morley, Elliot |
| Davidson, Ian | Morris, Estelle (B'ham Yardley) |
| Davies, Bryan (Oldham C'tral) | Mullin, Chris |
| Davies, Ron (Caerphilly) | Rooney, Terry |
| Denham, John | Simpson, Alan |
| Dixon, Don | Skinner, Dennis |
| Donohoe, Brian H. | Spearing, Nigel |
| Enright, Derek | Spellar, John |
| Flynn, Paul | Turner, Dennis |
| Godman, Dr Norman A. | Wigley, Dafydd |
| Godsiff, Roger | Winnick, David |
| Gordon, Mildred | Wise, Audrey |
| Graham, Thomas | Wray, Jimmy |
| Henderson, Doug | |
| Hinchliffe, David | Tellers for the Noes: |
| Hood, Jimmy | Mr. Bob Cryer and |
| Hoyle, Doug | Mr. Andrew F. Bennett. |
| Hughes, Kevin (Doncaster N) |
§ Question accordingly agreed to.
§ Mr. Deputy Speaker (Mr. Geoffrey Lofthouse)With the leave of the House, I shall put together motions Nos. 4 to 19.
Hon. MembersObject.
Motion made, and Question put forthwith pursuant to Standing Order No. 101(5) (Standing Committees on Statutory Instruments, &c.),
That the draft Glasgow Underground (Rateable Values) (Scotland) Order 1993, which was laid before this House on 15th February, be approved.—[Mr. Patnick.]
§ The House divided:Ayes 249, Noes 49.
1004| Division No. 182] | [7.25 pm |
| AYES | |
| Adley, Robert | Baker, Nicholas (Dorset North) |
| Ainsworth, Peter (East Surrey) | Baldry, Tony |
| Aitken, Jonathan | Banks, Robert (Harrogate) |
| Alexander, Richard | Beggs, Roy |
| Alison, Rt Hon Michael (Selby) | Beith, Rt Hon A. J. |
| Alton, David | Bellingham, Henry |
| Amess, David | Beresford, Sir Paul |
| Ancram, Michael | Blackburn, Dr John G. |
| Arbuthnot, James | Body, Sir Richard |
| Arnold, Jacques (Gravesham) | Bonsor, Sir Nicholas |
| Arnold, Sir Thomas (Hazel Grv) | Booth, Hartley |
| Aspinwall, Jack | Bottomley, Rt Hon Virginia |
| Atkinson, David (Bour'mouth E) | Bowis, John |
| Atkinson, Peter (Hexham) | Boyson, Rt Hon Sir Rhodes |
| Brandreth, Gyles | Hayes, Jerry |
| Brazier, Julian | Heald, Oliver |
| Bright, Graham | Heath, Rt Hon Sir Edward |
| Brooke, Rt Hon Peter | Heathcoat-Amory, David |
| Brown, M. (Brigg & Cl'thorpes) | Hendry, Charles |
| Browning, Mrs. Angela | Heseltine, Rt Hon Michael |
| Bruce, Ian (S Dorset) | Higgins, Rt Hon Sir Terence L. |
| Burt, Alistair | Hogg, Rt Hon Douglas (G'tham) |
| Butcher, John | Horam, John |
| Butler, Peter | Howarth, Alan (Strat'rd-on-A) |
| Campbell, Menzies (Fife NE) | Howell, Rt Hon David (G'dford) |
| Carlile, Alexander (Montgomry) | Hunt, Rt Hon David (Wirral W) |
| Carlisle, Kenneth (Lincoln) | Hunt, Sir John (Ravensbourne) |
| Carrington, Matthew | Hunter, Andrew |
| Carttiss, Michael | Jack, Michael |
| Cash, William | Jessel, Toby |
| Chapman, Sydney | Jones, Gwilym (Cardiff N) |
| Clappison, James | Jones, Nigel (Cheltenham) |
| Clarke, Rt Hon Kenneth (Ruclif) | Jones, Robert B. (W Hertfdshr) |
| Clifton-Brown, Geoffrey | Jopling, Rt Hon Michael |
| Coe, Sebastian | Kellett-Bowman, Dame Elaine |
| Conway, Derek | Kennedy, Charles (Ross,C&S) |
| Coombs, Anthony (Wyre For'st) | Key, Robert |
| Coombs, Simon (Swindon) | Kilfedder, Sir James |
| Cope, Rt Hon Sir John | King, Rt Hon Tom |
| Cran, James | Kirkwood, Archy |
| Currie, Mrs Edwina (S D'by'ire) | Knapman, Roger |
| Curry, David (Skipton & Ripon) | Knight, Mrs Angela (Erewash) |
| Davies, Quentin (Stamford) | Knight, Greg (Derby N) |
| Davis, David (Boothferry) | Kynoch, George (Kincardine) |
| Day, Stephen | Lait, Mrs Jacqui |
| Deva, Nirj Joseph | Lawrence, Sir Ivan |
| Devlin, Tim | Legg, Barry |
| Dorrell, Stephen | Leigh, Edward |
| Douglas-Hamilton, Lord James | Lennox-Boyd, Mark |
| Dover, Den | Lester, Jim (Broxtowe) |
| Duncan, Alan | Lidington, David |
| Duncan-Smith, Iain | Lightbown, David |
| Dunn, Bob | Lloyd, Peter (Fareham) |
| Durant, Sir Anthony | Lord, Michael |
| Dykes, Hugh | Luff, Peter |
| Elletson, Harold | Lyell, Rt Hon Sir Nicholas |
| Evans, David (Welwyn Hatfield) | Lynne, Ms Liz |
| Evans, Jonathan (Brecon) | MacKay, Andrew |
| Evans, Nigel (Ribble Valley) | Maclean, David |
| Evennett, David | Madel, David |
| Faber, David | Maitland, Lady Olga |
| Fabricant, Michael | Malone, Gerald |
| Fenner, Dame Peggy | Mans, Keith |
| Field, Barry (Isle of Wight) | Marlow, Tony |
| Fishburn, Dudley | Marshall, John (Hendon S) |
| Forman, Nigel | Marshall, Sir Michael (Arundel) |
| Forsyth, Michael (Stirling) | Martin, David (Portsmouth S) |
| Forth, Eric | Mawhinney, Dr Brian |
| Fox, Sir Marcus (Shipley) | Mayhew, Rt Hon Sir Patrick |
| Freeman, Roger | Mellor, Rt Hon David |
| Fry, Peter | Merchant, Piers |
| Gale, Roger | Michie, Mrs Ray (Argyll Bute) |
| Gallie, Phil | Milligan, Stephen |
| Gardiner, Sir George | Moate, Sir Roger |
| Garel-Jones, Rt Hon Tristan | Molyneaux, Rt Hon James |
| Garnier, Edward | Monro, Sir Hector |
| Gill, Christopher | Moss, Malcolm |
| Goodson-Wickes, Dr Charles | Needham, Richard |
| Gorman, Mrs Teresa | Neubert, Sir Michael |
| Gorst, John | Newton, Rt Hon Tony |
| Greenway, Harry (Eating N) | Nicholls, Patrick |
| Greenway, John (Ryedale) | Onslow, Rt Hon Sir Cranley |
| Griffiths, Peter (Portsmouth, N) | Oppenheim, Phillip |
| Hague, William | Page, Richard |
| Hamilton, Rt Hon Archie (Epsom) | Paice, James |
| Hamilton, Neil (Tatton) | Patnick, Irvine |
| Hampson, Dr Keith | Pattie, Rt Hon Sir Geoffrey |
| Hanley, Jeremy | Pawsey, James |
| Hannam, Sir John | Peacock, Mrs Elizabeth |
| Harris, David | Pickles, Eric |
| Harvey, Nick | Porter, David (Waveney) |
| Haselhurst, Alan | Portillo, Rt Hon Michael |
| Hawkins, Nick | Rathbone, Tim |
| Hawksley, Warren | Redwood, John |
| Richards, Rod | Taylor, Sir Teddy (Southend, E) |
| Riddick, Graham | Thomason, Roy |
| Robathan, Andrew | Thompson, Patrick (Norwich N) |
| Roberts, Rt Hon Sir Wyn | Thornton, Sir Malcolm |
| Robertson, Raymond (Ab'd'n S) | Thurnham, Peter |
| Robinson, Mark (Somerton) | Townsend, Cyril D. (Bexl'yh'th) |
| Rowe, Andrew (Mid Kent) | Tracey, Richard |
| Ryder, Rt Hon Richard | Tredinnick, David |
| Sackville, Tom | Trend, Michael |
| Sainsbury, Rt Hon Tim | Twinn, Dr Ian |
| Shaw, David (Dover) | Viggers, Peter |
| Shersby, Michael | Walden, George |
| Sims, Roger | Waller, Gary |
| Smith, Tim (Beaconsfield) | Ward, John |
| Speed, Sir Keith | Wardle, Charles (Bexhill) |
| Spencer, Sir Derek | Waterson, Nigel |
| Spicer, Sir James (W Dorset) | Wells, Bowen |
| Spicer, Michael (S Worcs) | Wheeler, Rt Hon Sir John |
| Spink, Dr Robert | Whittingdale, John |
| Spring, Richard | Widdecombe, Ann |
| Sproat, Iain | Wigley, Dafydd |
| Squire, Robin (Hornchurch) | Willetts, David |
| Steel, Rt Hon Sir David | Wilshire, David |
| Steen, Anthony | Winterton, Mrs Ann (Congleton) |
| Stephen, Michael | Winterton, Nicholas (Macc'f'ld) |
| Stern, Michael | Wolfson, Mark |
| Stewart, Allan | Wood, Timothy |
| Streeter, Gary | Yeo, Tim |
| Sykes, John | |
| Tapsell, Sir Peter | Tellers for the Ayes: |
| Taylor, Ian (Esher) | Mr. Robert G. Hughes and |
| Taylor, John M. (Solihull) | Mr. Andrew Mitchell. |
| Taylor, Matthew (Truro) | |
| NOES | |
| Allen, Graham | Loyden, Eddie |
| Austin-Walker, John | McAvoy, Thomas |
| Barnes, Harry | McCartney, Ian |
| Callaghan, Jim | McMaster, Gordon |
| Campbell-Savours, D. N. | Madden, Max |
| Canavan, Dennis | Martin, Michael J. (Springburn) |
| Cann, Jamie | Martlew, Eric |
| Chisholm, Malcolm | Meale, Alan |
| Cohen, Harry | Milburn, Alan |
| Corbyn, Jeremy | Mitchell, Austin (Gt Grimsby) |
| Davidson, Ian | Mullin, Chris |
| Davies, Bryan (Oldham C'tral) | Prentice, Ms Bridget (Lew'm E) |
| Davies, Ron (Caerphilly) | Redmond, Martin |
| Dixon, Don | Rooney, Terry |
| Dowd, Jim | Simpson, Alan |
| Enright, Derek | Skinner, Dennis |
| Flynn, Paul | Spearing, Nigel |
| Godman, Dr Norman A. | Spellar. John |
| Gordon, Mildred | Steinberg, Gerry |
| Graham, Thomas | Winnick, David |
| Griffiths, Nigel (Edinburgh S) | Wise, Audrey |
| Hinchliffe, David | Wray, Jimmy |
| Hood, Jimmy | |
| Janner, Greville | Tellers for the Noes: |
| Jowell, Tessa | Mr. Bob Cryer and |
| Lewis, Terry | Mr. Andrew F. Bennett. |
| Lloyd, Tony (Stretford) |
§ Question accordingly agreed to.
§
Motion made, and Question put forthwith pursuant to Standing Order No. 101(5) (Standing Committees on Statutory Instruments, &c.),
That the draft Industrial and Freight Transport (Rateable Values) >(Scotland) Order 1993, which was laid before this House on 15th February, be approved.—[Mr. Patnick.]
§ The House Proceeded to a Division—
§ The Tellers having come to the Table—
§ Mr. Andrew F. Bennett (Denton and Reddish)On a point of order, Mr. Lofthouse. As I understand it, the doors were locked in the middle of the vote, Which is not 1005 correct procedure. As soon as I found out that that had happened, I reported to you that I was not satisfied that the vote had been carried out in the correct manner.
I understand that, during that period, some hon. Members went through the doors. I realise that, in your view, it was not unfortunate that the doors were locked for only a short period, but I am sure that you will accept that it is unprecedented for the doors to be locked during the eight minutes that are made available for hon. Members to vote. I can only suggest that the vote be taken again.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerI am advised that hon. Members went into the Lobbies without being counted. I have to order another Division.
§ The House having divided: Ayes 181, Noes 43.
1006| Division No. 183] | [at 7.47 pm |
| AYES | |
| Ainsworth, Peter (East Surrey) | Gale, Roger |
| Aitken, Jonathan | Gallie, Phil |
| Alton, David | Gardiner, Sir George |
| Amess, David | Garel-Jones, Rt Hon Tristan |
| Arbuthnot, James | Garnier, Edward |
| Arnold, Jacques (Gravesham) | Gill, Christopher |
| Arnold, Sir Thomas (Hazel Grv) | Goodson-Wickes, Dr Charles |
| Aspinwall, Jack | Gorman, Mrs Teresa |
| Atkinson, Peter (Hexham) | Gorst, John |
| Banks, Robert (Harrogate) | Greenway, Harry (Eating N) |
| Beggs, Roy | Greenway, John (Ryedale) |
| Beith, Rt Hon A. J. | Griffiths, Peter (Portsmouth, N) |
| Bellingham, Henry | Hague, William |
| Beresford, Sir Paul | Hamilton, Neil (Tatton) |
| Blackburn, Dr John G. | Hanley, Jeremy |
| Bonsor, Sir Nicholas | Harris, David |
| Bowis, John | Harvey, Nick |
| Boyson, Rt Hon Sir Rhodes | Haselhurst, Alan |
| Brandreth, Gyles | Hawksley, Warren |
| Brazier, Julian | Heald, Oliver |
| Bright, Graham | Heath, Rt Hon Sir Edward |
| Brown, M. (Brigg & Cl'thorpes) | Heathcoat-Amory, David |
| Browning, Mrs. Angela | Hendry, Charles |
| Butcher, John | Higgins, Rt Hon Sir Terence L. |
| Butler, Peter | Horam, John |
| Campbell, Menzies (Fife NE) | Howarth, Alan (Strat'rd-on-A) |
| Carlile, Alexander (Montgomry) | Howell, Rt Hon David (G'dford) |
| Carlisle, Kenneth (Lincoln) | Hughes Robert G. (Harrow W) |
| Carrington, Matthew | Hughes, Simon (Southwark) |
| Carttiss, Michael | Hunter, Andrew |
| Cash, William | Jack, Michael |
| Chapman, Sydney | Jones, Gwilym (Cardiff N) |
| Clappison, James | Jones, Nigel (Cheltenham) |
| Coe, Sebastian | Jones, Robert B. (W Hertfdshr) |
| Colvin, Michael | Jopling, Rt Hon Michael |
| Conway, Derek | Kellett-Bowman, Dame Elaine |
| Coombs, Anthony (Wyre For'st) | Kennedy, Charles (Ross,C&S) |
| Coombs, Simon (Swindon) | Key, Robert |
| Cope, Rt Hon Sir John | Kilfedder, Sir James |
| Cran, James | King, Rt Hon Tom |
| Currie, Mrs Edwina (S D'by'ire) | Kirkwood, Archy |
| Davies, Quentin (Stamford) | Knapman, Roger |
| Davis, David (Boothferry) | Knight, Greg (Derby N) |
| Devlin, Tim | Kynoch, George (Kincardine) |
| Douglas-Hamilton, Lord James | Lait, Mrs Jacqui |
| Dover, Den | Lawrence, Sir Ivan |
| Duncan, Alan | Legg, Barry |
| Duncan-Smith, Iain | Lennox-Boyd, Mark |
| Dykes, Hugh | Lidington, David |
| Elletson, Harold | Lightbown, David |
| Evans, Jonathan (Brecon) | Lord, Michael |
| Evennett, David | Luff, Peter |
| Faber, David | Lyell, Rt Hon Sir Nicholas |
| Fabricant, Michael | Lynne, Ms Liz |
| Field, Barry (Isle of Wight) | MacKay, Andrew |
| Fishburn, Dudley | Maclean, David |
| Fox, Sir Marcus (Shipley) | Maitland, Lady Olga |
| Freeman, Roger | Malone, Gerald |
| Fry, Peter | Mans, Keith |
| Marlow, Tony | Steen, Anthony |
| Marshall, Sir Michael (Arundel) | Stephen, Michael |
| Martin, David (Portsmouth S) | Stern, Michael |
| Merchant, Piers | Stewart, Allan |
| Michie, Mrs Ray (Argyll Bute) | Streeter, Gary |
| Milligan, Stephen | Sykes, John |
| Moate, Sir Roger | Taylor, Ian (Esher) |
| Molyneaux, Rt Hon James | Taylor, Matthew (Truro) |
| Moss, Malcolm | Thomason, Roy |
| Neubert, Sir Michael | Thompson, Patrick (Norwich N) |
| Newton, Rt Hon Tony | Thornton, Sir Malcolm |
| Nicholls, Patrick | Thurnham, Peter |
| Page, Richard | Townsend, Cyril D. (Bexl'yh'th) |
| Patnick, Irvine | Trend, Michael |
| Pawsey, James | Twinn, Dr Ian |
| Peacock, Mrs Elizabeth | Viggers, Peter |
| Pickles, Eric | Walden, George |
| Porter, David (Waveney) | Waller, Gary |
| Redwood, John | Wardle, Charles (Bexhill) |
| Richards, Rod | Waterson, Nigel |
| Riddick, Graham | Wheeler, Rt Hon Sir John |
| Roberts, Rt Hon Sir Wyn | Whittingdale, John |
| Robertson, Raymond (Ab'd'n S) | Widdecombe, Ann |
| Robinson, Mark (Somerton) | Wigley, Dafydd |
| Ryder, Rt Hon Richard | Willetts, David |
| Shaw, David (Dover) | Wilshire, David |
| Sims, Roger | Winterton, Mrs Ann (Congleton) |
| Smith, Tim (Beaconsfield) | Winterton, Nicholas (Macc'f'ld) |
| Speed, Sir Keith | Wood, Timothy |
| Spencer, Sir Derek | |
| Spicer, Sir James (W Dorset) | Tellers for the Ayes: |
| Spink, Dr Robert | Mr. Nicholas Baker and |
| Sproat, Iain | Mr. Andrew Mitchell. |
| Steel, Rt Hon Sir David | |
| NOES | |
| Austin-Walker, John | McAvoy, Thomas |
| Barnes, Harry | McCartney, Ian |
| Callaghan, Jim | Martin, Michael J. (Springburn) |
| Campbell-Savours, D. N. | Martlew, Eric |
| Cann, Jamie | Mitchell, Austin (Gt Grimsby) |
| Chisholm, Malcolm | Morris, Estelle (B'ham Yardley) |
| Clwyd, Mrs Ann | Mullin, Chris |
| Cohen, Harry | Pickthall, Colin |
| Corbyn, Jeremy | Prentice, Ms Bridget (Lew'm E) |
| Davidson, Ian | Redmond, Martin |
| Dixon, Don | Rooney, Terry |
| Dowd, Jim | Simpson, Alan |
| Fatchett, Derek | Skinner, Dennis |
| Flynn, Paul | Spearing, Nigel |
| Gerrard, Neil | Spellar, John |
| Godman, Dr Norman A. | Turner, Dennis |
| Gordon, Mildred | Winnick, David |
| Graham, Thomas | Wise, Audrey |
| Griffiths, Nigel (Edinburgh S) | Wray, Jimmy |
| Hinchliffe, David | |
| Hood, Jimmy | Tellers for the Noes: |
| Jamieson, David | Mr. Bob Cryer and |
| Lewis, Terry | Mr. Andrew F. Bennett. |
| Loyden, Eddie |
§ Question accordingly agreed to.
§
Motion made, and Question put forthwith pursuant to Standing Order No. 101(5) (Standing Committees on Statutory Instruments, &c).
That the draft Lochaber Power Company (Rateable Values) (Scotland) Order 1993, which was laid before this House on 15th February, be approved.—[Mr. Patnick.]
§ The House proceeded to a Division—
§ Mr. Phil Gallie (Ayr)(seated and covered): On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. May I point out that these Divisions on non-contentious matters which are of great benefit to the people and councils of Scotland are a dastardly attempt by the Labour party to rob the people of Scotland of cash which they deserve and which there is no reason to stop?
§ Mr. Deputy Speaker (Mr. Michael Morris)That is not a matter for the Chair, but the hon. Gentleman may be aware that the general public will read Hansard and make their judgment accordingly.
§ The House having divided: Ayes 180, Noes 33.
1008| Division No. 184] | [7.59 pm |
| AYES | |
| Ainsworth, Peter (East Surrey) | Greenway, John (Ryedale) |
| Aitken, Jonathan | Griffiths, Peter (Portsmouth, N) |
| Alison, Rt Hon Michael (Selby) | Hague, William |
| Alton, David | Hanley, Jeremy |
| Amess, David | Harris, David |
| Arbuthnot, James | Harvey, Nick |
| Arnold, Jacques (Gravesham) | Haselhurst, Alan |
| Arnold, Sir Thomas (Hazel Grv) | Hawksley, Warren |
| Aspinwall, Jack | Heald, Oliver |
| Atkinson, Peter (Hexham) | Heath, Rt Hon Sir Edward |
| Austin-Walker, John | Heathcoat-Amory, David |
| Barnes, Harry | Hendry, Charles |
| Beggs, Roy | Higgins, Rt Hon Sir Terence L. |
| Beith, Rt Hon A. J. | Howarth, Alan (Strat'rd-on-A) |
| Beresford, Sir Paul | Howell, Rt Hon David (G'dford) |
| Blackburn, Dr John G. | Hughes Robert G. (Harrow W) |
| Bonsor, Sir Nicholas | Hunt, Sir John (Ravensbourne) |
| Bowis, John | Hunter, Andrew |
| Boyson, Rt Hon Sir Rhodes | Jack, Michael |
| Brandreth, Gyles | Jones, Gwilym (Cardiff N) |
| Brazier, Julian | Jones, Nigel (Cheltenham) |
| Bright, Graham | Jones, Robert B. (W Hertfdshr) |
| Brown, M. (Brigg &Cl'thorpes) | Jopling, Rt Hon Michael |
| Browning, Mrs. Angela | Kellett-Bowman, Dame Elaine |
| Butcher, John | Kennedy, Charles (Ross.C&S) |
| Campbell, Menzies (Fife NE) | Key, Robert |
| Campbell-Savours, D. N. | Kilfedder, Sir James |
| Carlile, Alexander (Montgomry) | King, Rt Hon Tom |
| Carlisle, Kenneth (Lincoln) | Kirkwood, Archy |
| Carrington, Matthew | Knapman, Roger |
| Carttiss, Michael | Knight, Greg (Derby N) |
| Cash, William | Kynoch, George (Kincardine) |
| Chapman, Sydney | Lait, Mrs Jacqui |
| Clappison, James | Lawrence, Sir Ivan |
| Clarke, Rt Hon Kenneth (Ruclif) | Legg, Barry |
| Coe, Sebastian | Lennox-Boyd, Mark |
| Colvin, Michael | Lewis, Terry |
| Conway, Derek | Lidington, David |
| Coombs, Anthony (Wyre For'st) | Lightbown, David |
| Coombs, Simon (Swindon) | Lord, Michael |
| Cope, Rt Hon Sir John | Loyden, Eddie |
| Cran, James | Luff, Peter |
| Currie, Mrs Edwina (S D'by'ire) | Lyell, Rt Hon Sir Nicholas |
| Davies, Quentin (Stamford) | Lynne, Ms Liz |
| Davis, David (Boothferry) | Maclean, David |
| Devlin, Tim | Maitland, Lady Olga |
| Dixon, Don | Malone, Gerald |
| Douglas-Hamilton, Lord James | Mans, Keith |
| Dover, Den | Marlow, Tony |
| Duncan, Alan | Marshall, Sir Michael (Arundel) |
| Duncan-Smith, Iain | Merchant, Piers |
| Dykes, Hugh | Michie, Mrs Ray (Argyll Bute) |
| Elletson, Harold | Milligan, Stephen |
| Evans, Jonathan (Brecon) | Mitchell, Andrew (Gedling) |
| Evennett, David | Moate, Sir Roger |
| Faber, David | Moss, Malcolm |
| Fabricant, Michael | Neubert, Sir Michael |
| Fatchett, Derek | Newton, Rt Hon Tony |
| Fenner, Dame Peggy | Nicholls, Patrick |
| Fishburn, Dudley | Page, Richard |
| Fox, Sir Marcus (Shipley) | Patnick, Irvine |
| Freeman, Roger | Pawsey, James |
| Gale, Roger | Pickles, Eric |
| Gallic, Phil | Porter, David (Waveney) |
| Gardiner, Sir George | Redwood, John |
| Garel-Jones, Rt Hon Tristan | Richards, Rod |
| Garnier, Edward | Riddick, Graham |
| Gill, Christopher | Roberts, Rt Hon Sir Wyn |
| Goodson-Wickes, Dr Charles | Robertson, Raymond (Ab'd'n S) |
| Gorst, John | Robinson, Mark (Somerton) |
| Greenway, Harry (Eating N) | Rooney, Terry |
| Ryder, Rt Hon Richard | Townsend, Cyril D. (Bexl'yh'th) |
| Shaw, David (Dover) | Trend, Michael |
| Sims, Roger | Twinn, Dr Ian |
| Smith, Tim (Beaconsfield) | Viggers, Peter |
| Speed, Sir Keith | Walden, George |
| Spencer, Sir Derek | Waller, Gary |
| Spicer, Sir James (W Dorset) | Wardle, Charles (Bexhill) |
| Spink, Dr Robert | Waterson, Nigel |
| Sproat, Iain | Wheeler, Rt Hon Sir John |
| Steel, Rt Hon Sir David | Whittingdale, John |
| Steen, Anthony | Widdecombe, Ann |
| Stephen, Michael | Wigley, Dafydd |
| Stern, Michael | Willetts, David |
| Stewart, Allan | Wilshire, David |
| Streeter, Gary | Winterton, Mrs Ann (Congleton) |
| Sykes, John | Winterton, Nicholas (Macc'f'ld) |
| Taylor, Ian (Esher) | Wood, Timothy |
| Taylor, Matthew (Truro) | |
| Thomason, Roy | Tellers for the Ayes: |
| Thompson, Patrick (Norwich N) | Mr. Andrew MacKay and |
| Thurnham, Peter | Mr. Nicholas Baker. |
| NOES | |
| Bayley, Hugh | Martin, Michael J. (Springburn) |
| Callaghan, Jim | Martlew, Eric |
| Cann, Jamie | Morris, Estelle (B'ham Yardley) |
| Chisholm, Malcolm | Pickthall, Colin |
| Clwyd, Mrs Ann | Prentice, Ms Bridget (Lew'm E) |
| Cohen, Harry | Prescott, John |
| Corbyn, Jeremy | Redmond, Martin |
| Davidson, Ian | Simpson, Alan |
| Davies, Ron (Caerphilly) | Skinner, Dennis |
| Dowd, Jim | Spearing, Nigel |
| Flynn, Paul | Spellar, John |
| Godman, Dr Norman A. | Taylor, Mrs Ann (Dewsbury) |
| Gordon, Mildred | Wise, Audrey |
| Graham, Thomas | Wray, Jimmy |
| Griffiths. Nigel (Edinburgh S) | |
| Hinchliffe, David | Tellers for the Noes: |
| Hood, Jimmy | Mr. Bob Cryer and |
| Jones, Jon Owen (Cardiff C) | Mr. Andrew F. Bennett. |
| McAvoy, Thomas |
§ Question accordingly agreed to.
§ Motion made, and Question put forthwith pursuant to Standing Order No. 101(5) (Standing Committees on Statutory Instruments, &c),
§ That the draft Mercury Communications Ltd. (Rateable Values)(Scotland) Order 1993, which was laid before this House on 15th February, be approved.—[Mr. Wood.]
§ The House divided: Ayes 158, Noes 41.
1010| Division No. 185] | [8.10 pm |
| AYES | |
| Ainsworth, Peter (East Surrey) | Carlisle, Kenneth (Lincoln) |
| Aitken, Jonathan | Carrington, Matthew |
| Alison, Rt Hon Michael (Selby) | Cash, William |
| Alton, David | Chapman, Sydney |
| Amess, David | Clappison, James |
| Arbuthnot, James | Clarke, Rt Hon Kenneth (Ruclif) |
| Arnold, Jacques (Gravesham) | Coe, Sebastian |
| Arnold, Sir Thomas (Hazel Grv) | Colvin, Michael |
| Aspinwall, Jack | Conway, Derek |
| Atkinson, Peter (Hexham) | Coombs, Anthony (Wyre For'st) |
| Baker, Nicholas (Dorset North) | Coombs, Simon (Swindon) |
| Beggs, Roy | Cope, Rt Hon Sir John |
| Beith, Rt Hon A. J. | Cran, James |
| Beresford, Sir Paul | Currie, Mrs Edwina (S D'by'ire) |
| Blackburn, Dr John G. | Davis, David (Boothferry) |
| Bonsor, Sir Nicholas | Devlin, Tim |
| Bowis, John | Douglas-Hamilton, Lord James |
| Brandreth, Gyles | Dover, Den |
| Brazier, Julian | Duncan, Alan |
| Bright, Graham | Duncan-Smith, Iain |
| Brown, M. (Brigg &Cl'thorpes) | Elletson, Harold |
| Browning, Mrs. Angela | Evans, Jonathan (Brecon) |
| Butcher, John | Faber, David |
| Campbell, Menzies (Fife NE) | Fabricant, Michael |
| Carlile, Alexander (Montgomry) | Fenner, Dame Peggy |
| Fishburn, Dudley | Michie, Mrs Ray (Argyll Bute) |
| Fox, Sir Marcus (Shipley) | Milligan, Stephen |
| Freeman, Roger | Mitchell, Andrew (Gedling) |
| Gale, Roger | Moate, Sir Roger |
| Gallie, Phil | Morley, Elliot |
| Garel-Jones, Rt Hon Tristan | Moss, Malcolm |
| Garnier, Edward | Neubert, Sir Michael |
| Gill, Christopher | Newton, Rt Hon Tony |
| Goodson-Wickes, Dr Charles | Nicholls, Patrick |
| Gorst, John | Page, Richard |
| Greenway, Harry (Ealing N) | Pawsey, James |
| Greenway, John (Ryedale) | Pickles, Eric |
| Griffiths, Peter (Portsmouth, N) | Porter, David (Waveney) |
| Hague, William | Redwood, John |
| Hanley, Jeremy | Richards, Rod |
| Harris, David | Roberts, Rt Hon Sir Wyn |
| Harvey, Nick | Robertson, Raymond (Ab'd'n S) |
| Haselhurst, Alan | Robinson, Mark (Somerton) |
| Hawksley, Warren | Ryder, Rt Hon Richard |
| Heald, Oliver | Shaw, David (Dover) |
| Heath, Rt Hon Sir Edward | Sims, Roger |
| Heathcoat-Amory, David | Smith, Tim (Beaconsfield) |
| Hendry, Charles | Spencer, Sir Derek |
| Howarth, Alan (Strat'rd-on-A) | Spink, Dr Robert |
| Hughes Robert G. (Harrow W) | Sproat, Iain |
| Hughes, Simon (Southwark) | Steel, Rt Hon Sir David |
| Hunt, Sir John (Ravensbourne) | Steen, Anthony |
| Hunter, Andrew | Stephen, Michael |
| Jack, Michael | Stern, Michael |
| Jones, Gwilym (Cardiff N) | Stewart, Allan |
| Jones, Nigel (Cheltenham) | Streeter, Gary |
| Jones, Robert B. (W Hertfdshr) | Sykes, John |
| Jopling, Rt Hon Michael | Taylor, Ian (Esher) |
| Kellett-Bowman, Dame Elaine | Taylor, Matthew (Truro) |
| Kennedy, Charles (Ross,C&S) | Thomason, Roy |
| Kilfedder, Sir James | Thompson, Patrick (Norwich N) |
| Kirkwood, Archy | Thurnham, Peter |
| Knapman, Roger | Townsend, Cyril D. (Bexl'yh'th) |
| Knight, Greg (Derby N) | Trend, Michael |
| Kynoch, George (Kincardine) | Twinn, Dr Ian |
| Lait, Mrs Jacqui | Tyler, Paul |
| Lawrence, Sir Ivan | Viggers, Peter |
| Legg, Barry | Walden, George |
| Lennox-Boyd, Mark | Waller, Gary |
| Lidington, David | Wardle, Charles (Bexhill) |
| Lightbown, David | Wheeler, Rt Hon Sir John |
| Lord, Michael | Whittingdale, John |
| Luff, Peter | Widdecombe, Ann |
| Lyell, Rt Hon Sir Nicholas | Wigley, Dafydd |
| Lynne, Ms Liz | Wi Herts, David |
| Maclean, David | Winterton, Nicholas (Macc'f'ld) |
| Maitland, Lady Olga | Wood, Timothy |
| Malone, Gerald | |
| Mans, Keith | Tellers for the Ayes: |
| Marlow, Tony | Mr. Irvine Patrick and |
| Merchant, Piers | Mr. Andrew MacKay. |
| NOES | |
| Barnes, Harry | Graham, Thomas |
| Bayley, Hugh | Griffiths, Nigel (Edinburgh S) |
| Bennett, Andrew F. | Hall, Mike |
| Callaghan, Jim | Hinchliffe, David |
| Campbell-Savours, D. N. | Hood, Jimmy |
| Cann, Jamie | Loyden, Eddie |
| Chisholm, Malcolm | McAvoy, Thomas |
| Clwyd, Mrs Ann | McWilliam, John |
| Cohen, Harry | Martin, Michael J. (Springburn) |
| Corbyn, Jeremy | Martlew, Eric |
| Cryer, Bob | Morris, Estelle (B'ham Yardley) |
| Davidson, Ian | Pickthall, Colin |
| Davies, Rt Hon Denzil (Llanelli) | Prentice, Ms Bridget (Lew'm E) |
| Dixon, Don | Redmond, Martin |
| Dowd, Jim | Rooney, Terry |
| Fatchett, Derek | Simpson, Alan |
| Flynn, Paul | Spearing, Nigel |
| Godman, Dr Norman A. | Spellar, John |
| Gordon, Mildred | Taylor, Mrs Ann (Dewsbury) |
| Winnick, David | Tellers for the Noes: |
| Wise, Audrey | Mr. Dennis Skinner and |
| Wray, Jimmy | Mr. Terry Lewis. |
§ Question accordingly agreed to.
§
Motion made, and Question put forthwith pursuant to Standing Order No. 101(5)(Standing Committees on Statutory Instruments, &c),
That the draft Mines and Quarries (Rateable Values) (Scotland) Order 1993, which was laid before this House on 15th February, be approved.—[Mr. Wood.]
§ The House divided: Ayes 148, Noes 42.
1011| Division No. 186] | [8.20 pm |
| AYES | |
| Ainsworth, Peter (East Surrey) | Harvey, Nick |
| Aitken, Jonathan | Hawksley, Warren |
| Alison, Rt Hon Michael (Selby) | Heald, Oliver |
| Alton, David | Heathcoat-Amory, David |
| Amess, David | Hendry, Charles |
| Arnold, Jacques (Gravesham) | Howarth, Alan (Strat'rd-on-A) |
| Arnold, Sir Thomas (Hazel Grv) | Hughes Robert G. (Harrow W) |
| Aspinwall, Jack | Hughes, Simon (Southwark) |
| Atkinson, Peter (Hexham) | Hunter, Andrew |
| Baker, Nicholas (Dorset North) | Jack, Michael |
| Beggs, Roy | Jones, Gwilym (Cardiff N) |
| Beith, Rt Hon A. J. | Jones, Nigel (Cheltenham) |
| Beresford, Sir Paul | Jones, Robert B. (W Hertfdshr) |
| Blackburn, Dr John G. | Jopling, Rt Hon Michael |
| Bowis, John | Kellett-Bowman, Dame Elaine |
| Brandreth, Gyles | Kennedy, Charles (Ross.C&S) |
| Brazier, Julian | Kilfedder, Sir James |
| Bright, Graham | Kirkwood, Archy |
| Brown, M. (Brigg & Cl'thorpes) | Knapman, Roger |
| Browning, Mrs. Angela | Knight, Greg (Derby N) |
| Butcher, John | Kynoch, George (Kincardine) |
| Campbell, Menzies (Fife NE) | Lait, Mrs Jacqui |
| Carlile, Alexander (Montgomry) | Legg, Barry |
| Carlisle, Kenneth (Lincoln) | Lennox-Boyd, Mark |
| Carrington, Matthew | Lidington, David |
| Carttiss, Michael | Lightbown, David |
| Cash, William | Lord, Michael |
| Chapman, Sydney | Luff, Peter |
| Clappison, James | Lyell, Rt Hon Sir Nicholas |
| Clarke, Rt Hon Kenneth (Ruclif) | Lynne, Ms Liz |
| Coe, Sebastian | MacKay, Andrew |
| Colvin, Michael | Maclean, David |
| Coombs, Simon (Swindon) | Maitland, Lady Olga |
| Cope, Rt Hon Sir John | Malone, Gerald |
| Cran, James | Marlow, Tony |
| Currie, Mrs Edwina (S D'by'ire) | Merchant, Piers |
| Davis, David (Boothferry) | Michie, Mrs Ray (Argyll Bute) |
| Devlin, Tim | Mitchell, Andrew (Gedling) |
| Douglas-Hamilton, Lord James | Moate, Sir Roger |
| Dover, Den | Neubert, Sir Michael |
| Duncan, Alan | Newton, Rt Hon Tony |
| Duncan-Smith, Iain | Nicholls, Patrick |
| Elletson, Harold | Page, Richard |
| Evans, Jonathan (Brecon) | Pawsey, James |
| Fabricant, Michael | Pickles, Eric |
| Fenner, Dame Peggy | Porter, David (Waveney) |
| Fishburn, Dudley | Redwood, John |
| Freeman, Roger | Richards, Rod |
| Fry, Peter | Riddick, Graham |
| Gale, Roger | Roberts, Rt Hon Sir Wyn |
| Gallie, Phil | Robertson, Raymond (Ab'd'n S) |
| Gardiner, Sir George | Robinson, Mark (Somerton) |
| Garel-Jones, Rt Hon Tristan | Ryder, Rt Hon Richard |
| Garnier, Edward | Shaw, David (Dover) |
| Gill, Christopher | Sims, Roger |
| Goodson-Wickes, Dr Charles | Smith, Tim (Beaconsfield) |
| Gorst, John | Spencer, Sir Derek |
| Greenway, Harry (Eating N) | Spink, Dr Robert |
| Greenway, John (Ryedale) | Sproat, Iain |
| Griffiths, Peter (Portsmouth, N) | Steel, Rt Hon Sir David |
| Hague, William | Steen, Anthony |
| Hanley, Jeremy | Stephen, Michael |
| Harris, David | Stern, Michael |
| Stewart, Allan | Waller, Gary |
| Streeter, Gary | Wardle, Charles (Bexhill) |
| Sykes, John | Wheeler, Rt Hon Sir John |
| Taylor, Ian (Esher) | Whittingdale, John |
| Taylor, Matthew (Truro) | Widdecombe, Ann |
| Thomason, Roy | Wigley, Dafydd |
| Thurnham, Peter | Willetts, David |
| Townsend, Cyril D. (Bexl'yh'th) | Winterton, Nicholas (Macc'f'ld) |
| Trend, Michael | Wood, Timothy |
| Twinn, Dr Ian | |
| Viggers, Peter | Tellers for the Ayes: |
| Walden, George | Mr. Irvine Patnick and |
| Walker, A. Cecil (Belfast N) | Mr. James Arbuthnot. |
| NOES | |
| Barnes, Harry | Hinchliffe, David |
| Bayley, Hugh | Hood, Jimmy |
| Bennett, Andrew F. | Jones, Jon Owen (Cardiff C) |
| Callaghan, Jim | Loyden, Eddie |
| Campbell-Savours, D. N. | McAvoy, Thomas |
| Cann, Jamie | Martin, Michael J. (Springburn) |
| Chisholm, Malcolm | Meale, Alan |
| Clark, Dr David (South Shields) | Mitchell, Austin (Gf Grimsby) |
| Clwyd, Mrs Ann | Morris, Estelle (B'ham Yardley) |
| Cohen, Harry | Pickthall, Colin |
| Corbyn, Jeremy | Prentice, Ms Bridget (Lew'm E) |
| Cryer, Bob | Redmond, Martin |
| Davidson, Ian | Rogers, Allan |
| Davies, Ron (Caerphilly) | Rooney, Terry |
| Dixon, Don | Spearing, Nigel |
| Dowd, Jim | Spellar, John |
| Fatchett, Derek | Taylor, Mrs Ann (Dewsbury) |
| Flynn, Paul | Wise, Audrey |
| Godman, Dr Norman A. | Wray, Jimmy |
| Gordon, Mildred | |
| Graham, Thomas | Tellers for the Noes: |
| Griffiths, Nigel (Edinburgh S) | Mr. Terry Lewis and |
| Hall, Mike | Mr. Dennis Skinner. |
§ Question accordingly agreed to.
§
Motion made, and Question put forthwith pursuant to Standing Order No. 101(5)(Standing Committees on Statutory Instruments, &c),
That the draft Oil Related and Petrochemical Plants (Rateable Value (Scotland) Order 1993, which was laid before this House on 15th February, be approved.—[Mr. Wood.]
§ The House proceeded to a Division—
§ Mr. Raymond S. Robertson (Aberdeen, South)(seated and covered): On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. Is it in order for English Labour Members to seek to defeat this order, thus ensuring that business rates in the oil industry in my constituency would be raised by 85 per cent.?
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerIt is open to any hon. Member to object to any motion.
§ Later—
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerI have asked the Clerk to inquire what the delay is in both Lobbies. If an hon. Member is purposely sitting there, it is verging on contempt of the House.
§ The House divided: Ayes 147, Noes 41.
1013| Division No. 187] | [8.36 pm |
| AYES | |
| Ainsworth, Peter (East Surrey) | Bayley, Hugh |
| Aitken, Jonathan | Beggs, Roy |
| Alison, Rt Hon Michael (Selby) | Bennett, Andrew F. |
| Alton, David | Beresford, Sir Paul |
| Amess, David | Blackburn, Dr John G. |
| Arbuthnot, James | Bonsor, Sir Nicholas |
| Arnold, Jacques (Gravesham) | Bowis, John |
| Arnold, Sir Thomas (Hazel Grv) | Brandreth, Gyles |
| Atkinson, Peter (Hexham) | Brazier, Julian |
| Bright, Graham | Lennox-Boyd, Mark |
| Brown, M. (Brigg & Cl'thorpes) | Lidington, David |
| Browning, Mrs. Angela | Lightbown, David |
| Butcher, John | Lord, Michael |
| Campbell, Menzies (Fife NE) | Luff, Peter |
| Campbell-Savours, D. N. | Lyell, Rt Hon Sir Nicholas |
| Carlile, Alexander (Montgomry) | Lynne, Ms Liz |
| Carlisle, Kenneth (Lincoln) | MacKay, Andrew |
| Carrington, Matthew | Maclean, David |
| Carttiss, Michael | Maitland, Lady Olga |
| Cash, William | Malone, Gerald |
| Chapman, Sydney | Marlow, Tony |
| Clappison, James | Merchant, Piers |
| Coombs, Simon (Swindon) | Michie, Mrs Ray (Argyll Bute) |
| Cope, Rt Hon Sir John | Mitchell, Andrew (Gedling) |
| Cran, James | Moate, Sir Roger |
| Currie, Mrs Edwina (S D'by'ire) | Molyneaux, Rt Hon James |
| Davis, David (Boothferry) | Neubert, Sir Michael |
| Devlin, Tim | Newton, Rt Hon Tony |
| Dorrell, Stephen | Nicholls, Patrick |
| Douglas-Hamilton, Lord James | Page, Richard |
| Dover, Den | Patnick, Irvine |
| Duncan, Alan | Pawsey, James |
| Duncan-Smith, Iain | Pickles, Eric |
| Dunn, Bob | Porter, David (Waveney) |
| Elletson, Harold | Purchase, Ken |
| Evans, Jonathan (Brecon) | Redwood, John |
| Fabricant, Michael | Richards, Rod |
| Fatchett, Derek | Riddick, Graham |
| Fenner, Dame Peggy | Roberts, Rt Hon Sir Wyn |
| Fishburn, Dudley | Robertson, Raymond (Ab'd'n S) |
| Freeman, Roger | Robinson, Mark (Somerton) |
| Gale, Roger | Rooney, Terry |
| Gallie, Phil | Ryder, Rt Hon Richard |
| Gardiner, Sir George | Shaw, David (Dover) |
| Garel-Jones, Rt Hon Tristan | Sims, Roger |
| Gill, Christopher | Smith, Tim (Beaconsfield) |
| Goodson-Wickes, Dr Charles | Spencer, Sir Derek |
| Gorst, John | Spink, Dr Robert |
| Graham, Thomas | Sproat, Iain |
| Greenway, Harry (Ealing N) | Steel, Rt Hon Sir David |
| Greenway, John (Ryedale) | Steen, Anthony |
| Griffiths, Peter (Portsmouth, N) | Stephen, Michael |
| Hague, William | Stern, Michael |
| Hanley, Jeremy | Stewart, Allan |
| Harris, David | Sykes, John |
| Harvey, Nick | Taylor, Ian (Esher) |
| Hawksley, Warren | Thomason, Roy |
| Heald, Oliver | Thurnham, Peter |
| Heathcoat-Amory, David | Townsend, Cyril D. (Bexl'yh'th) |
| Higgins, Rt Hon Sir Terence L. | Trend, Michael |
| Hood, Jimmy | Twinn, Dr Ian |
| Hunt, Sir John (Ravensbourne) | Viggers, Peter |
| Hunter, Andrew | Walden, George |
| Jack, Michael | Waller, Gary |
| Jones, Gwilym (Cardiff N) | Wheeler, Rt Hon Sir John |
| Jones, Nigel (Cheltenham) | Whittingdale, John |
| Jones, Robert B. (W Hertfdshr) | Widdecombe, Ann |
| Kellett-Bowman, Dame Elaine | Wigley, Dafydd |
| Kennedy, Charles (Ross, C&S) | Willetts, David |
| Kilfedder, Sir James | Wood, Timothy |
| Kirkwood, Archy | Wray, Jimmy |
| Knapman, Roger | |
| Knight, Greg (Derby N) | Tellers for the Ayes: |
| Kynoch, George (Kincardine) | Mr. Nicholas Baker and |
| Lait, Mrs Jacqui | Mr. Robert G. Hughes. |
| Legg, Barry | |
| NOES | |
| Barnes, Harry | Davies, Rt Hon Denzil (Llanelli) |
| Boateng, Paul | Denham, John |
| Callaghan, Jim | Dixon, Don |
| Cann, Jamie | Dowd, Jim |
| Chisholm, Malcolm | Flynn, Paul |
| Clark, Dr David (South Shields) | Godman, Dr Norman A. |
| Clwyd, Mrs Ann | Gordon, Mildred |
| Cohen, Harry | Graham, Thomas |
| Corbyn, Jeremy | Griffiths, Nigel (Edinburgh S) |
| Cryer, Bob | Gunnell, John |
| Davidson, Ian | Hinchliffe, David |
| Hood, Jimmy | Rogers, Allan |
| Howarth, George (Knowsley N) | Spearing, Nigel |
| Jackson, Helen (Shef'ld, H) | Spellar, John |
| Jones, Jon Owen (Cardiff C) | Taylor, Mrs Ann (Dewsbury) |
| Kilfoyle, Peter | Turner, Dennis |
| Loyden, Eddie | Winnick, David |
| McAvoy, Thomas | Wray, Jimmy |
| Martin, Michael J. (Springburn) | |
| Meale, Alan | Tellers for the Noes: |
| Morris, Estelle (B'ham Yardley) | Mr. Terry Lewis and |
| Prentice, Ms Bridget (Lew'm E) | Mr. Dennis Skinner. |
| Redmond. Martin |
§ Question accordingly agreed to.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerBefore I call the next motion, I draw the attention of the House to the fact that any obstruction of the Division Lobby is not acceptable to the Chair.
Motion made, and Question put forthwith pursuant to Standing Order No. 101(5) (Standing Committees on Statutory Instruments, &c.),
That the draft Scottish Hydro-Electric pic. (Rateable Values) (Scotland) Order 1993, which was laid before this House on 15th February, be approved.—[Mr. Wood.]
§ The House divided: Ayes 135, Noes 37.
1014| Division No. 189] | [9.10 pm |
| AYES | |
| Tellers for the Ayes: | |
| Mr. Bob Cryer and | |
| Mr. Harry Barnes. | |
| NOES | |
| Ainsworth, Peter (East Surrey) | Arnold, Sir Thomas (Hazel Grv) |
| Alison, Rt Hon Michael (Selby) | Atkinson, Peter (Hexham) |
| Alton, David | Baker, Nicholas (Dorset North) |
| Amess, David | Bayley, Hugh |
| Arbuthnot, James | Beggs, Roy |
| Arnold, Jacques (Gravesham) | Beith, Rt Hon A. J. |
| Bennett, Andrew F. | Kynoch, George (Kincardine) |
| Beresford, Sir Paul | Lait, Mrs Jacqui |
| Blackburn, Dr John G. | Legg, Barry |
| Bonsor, Sir Nicholas | Lennox-Boyd, Mark |
| Brandreth, Gyles | Lewis, Terry |
| Brazier, Julian | Lidington, David |
| Bright, Graham | Lightbown, David |
| Brown, M. (Brigg & Cl'thorpes) | Lord, Michael |
| Browning, Mrs. Angela | Loyden, Eddie |
| Burt, Alistair | Luff, Peter |
| Butcher, John | Lyell, Rt Hon Sir Nicholas |
| Callaghan, Jim | Lynne, Ms Liz |
| Campbell, Menzies (Fife NE) | McAvoy, Thomas |
| Campbell-Savours, D. N. | MacKay, Andrew |
| Cann, Jamie | Maclean, David |
| Carlisle, Kenneth (Lincoln) | Malone, Gerald |
| Carrington, Matthew | Marshall, Sir Michael (Arundel) |
| Carttiss, Michael | Martin, Michael J. (Springburn) |
| Cash, William | Meale, Alan |
| Clappison, James | Merchant, Piers |
| Clark, Dr David (South Shields) | Michie, Mrs Ray (Argyll Bute) |
| Clwyd, Mrs Ann | Mitchell, Andrew (Gedling) |
| Coombs, Simon (Swindon) | Mitchell, Austin (Gt Grimsby) |
| Cope, Rt Hon Sir John | Moate, Sir Roger |
| Cran, James | Molyneaux, Rt Hon James |
| Currie, Mrs Edwina (S D'by'ire) | Morris, Estelle (B'ham Yardley) |
| Davidson, Ian | Moss, Malcolm |
| Davies, Quentin (Stamford) | Mullin, Chris |
| Davis, David (Boothferry) | Neubert, Sir Michael |
| Devlin, Tim | Newton, Rt Hon Tony |
| Dixon, Don | Nicholls, Patrick |
| Douglas-Hamilton, Lord James | Page, Richard |
| Dover, Den | Parry, Robert |
| Duncan, Alan | Pattie, Rt Hon Sir Geoffrey |
| Duncan-Smith, Iain | Pawsey, James |
| Dunn, Bob | Pike, Peter L. |
| Elletson, Harold | Porter, David (Waveney) |
| Evans, Jonathan (Brecon) | Redwood, John |
| Fabricant, Michael | Richards, Rod |
| Fenner, Dame Peggy | Riddick, Graham |
| Fishburn, Dudley | Roberts, Rt Hon Sir Wyn |
| Flynn, Paul | Robertson, Raymond (Ab'd'n S) |
| Gale, Roger | Robinson, Mark (Somerton) |
| Gallie, Phil | Rooney, Terry |
| Gardiner, Sir George | Ross, William (E Londonderry) |
| Garel-Jones, Rt Hon Tristan | Rowe, Andrew (Mid Kent) |
| Gill, Christopher | Ryder, Rt Hon Richard |
| Godman, Dr Norman A. | Sainsbury, Rt Hon Tim |
| Goodson-Wickes, Dr Charles | Shaw, David (Dover) |
| Graham, Thomas | Sims, Roger |
| Greenway, Harry (Ealing N) | Skinner, Dennis |
| Greenway, John (Ryedale) | Smith, Tim (Beaconsfield) |
| Griffiths, Peter (Portsmouth, N) | Speed, Sir Keith |
| Gunnell, John | Spencer, Sir Derek |
| Hague, William | Spink, Dr Robert |
| Hanley, Jeremy | Sproat, Iain |
| Harris, David | Steel, Rt Hon Sir David |
| Harvey, Nick | Steen, Anthony |
| Haselhurst, Alan | Stephen, Michael |
| Hawksley, Warren | Stern, Michael |
| Heald, Oliver | Stewart, Allan |
| Heathcoat-Amory, David | Streeter, Gary |
| Higgins, Rt Hon Sir Terence L. | Sykes, John |
| Hood, Jimmy | Taylor, Mrs Ann (Dewsbury) |
| Hughes Robert G. (Harrow W) | Taylor, Ian (Esher) |
| Hunt, Sir John (Ravensbourne) | Thomason, Roy |
| Hunter, Andrew | Thurnham, Peter |
| Illsley, Eric | Trend, Michael |
| Jack, Michael | Twinn, Dr Ian |
| Jones, Gwilym (Cardiff N) | Tyler, Paul |
| Jones, Nigel (Cheltenham) | Viggers, Peter |
| Jones, Robert B. (W Hertfdshr) | Walden, George |
| Kellett-Bowman, Dame Elaine | Waller, Gary |
| Kennedy, Charles (Ross,C&S) | Wheeler, Rt Hon Sir John |
| Kilfedder, Sir James | Whittingdale, John |
| Kirkwood, Archy | Widdecombe, Ann |
| Knapman, Roger | Wigley, Dafydd |
| Knight, Greg (Derby N) | Willetts, David |
| Wood, Timothy | Tellers for the Noes: |
| Wray, Jimmy | Mr. Sydney Chapman and |
| Mr. Irvine Patnick. |
§ Question accordingly agreed to.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerBefore I call the next motion, may I say that I propose to invoke Standing Order No. 39. For those hon. Members who are not familiar with the Standing Order, after the lapse of two minutes on each motion I shall call the Ayes to stand and then to sit down and then the Noes to stand and then to sit down. I shall then make a judgment as to whether there is a clear majority one way or the other.
§ Mr. BennettOn a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. I wonder whether you might reconsider your ruling. As I understand it, that procedure has normally been used in the middle of a Bill. I cannot recall an occasion when it has been used on statutory instruments. The history of statutory instruments is of considerable importance as they all used to be taken on the Floor of the House. Only with the permission of the House are they referred to a Committee upstairs on the basis that, when they return, it will be possible for the House to express a clear view; in other words, for all hon. Members to record precisely their vote.
May I suggest that if you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, and the Government wish to proceed along this line, it is possible that my hon. Friends will decide that they do not want any orders to go upstairs to Committee. As I am sure you will appreciate—
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. The decision is a matter entirely for the Chair. I have not consulted anyone. It is my view that it is now appropriate to invoke the Standing Order.
§ Mr. D. N. Campbell-Savours (Workington)Further to that point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. The wording of Standing Order No. 39 is:
Mr. Speaker or the chairman may, after the lapse of two minutes, if in his opinion the division is unnecessarily claimed".You have said, Mr. Deputy Speaker, that you propose to exercise your discretion. However, surely there is a responsibility upon you to tell the House why you believe a Division is being unnecessarily claimed. I have a case to put to you that—[Interruption.] I am quoting from Standing Order No. 39, which says:if in his opinion the division is unnecessarily claimedI put it to you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, that these Divisions are being necessarily claimed. Some of us have voted in different Lobbies on different orders.May I draw your attention, Mr. Deputy Speaker, to the fact that I voted against the draft Electricity Generators (Rateable Values) (Scotland) Order—
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. I accept the hon. Gentleman's word. However, I made it clear that my decision would be made after a lapse of two minutes; I did not say what that decision would be. I said that if, in my opinion, it was necessary to invoke Standing Order No. 39, I would do so.
§ Mr. Bob Cryer (Bradford, South)As you know, Mr. Deputy Speaker, I am the Chairman of both the Joint Committee on Statutory Instruments and the Select Committee on Statutory Instruments. We have made the complaint that in 1992 the Government produced more statutory instruments than have ever before been produced in the history of Parliament. It would be a very serious departure from parliamentary scrutiny if the torrent of statutory instruments produced by the Government were not then subject to a vote on the Floor of the House. That would mean that the legislative sausage machine that the Government are using would become even worse.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerI have already made it clear that the House will not be denied a vote; the House will get its vote.
Notice being taken that strangers were present, MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER, pursuant to Standing Order No. 143 (Withdrawal of strangers from House), put forthwith the Question, That strangers do withdraw:—
§ The House divided: Aves 0. Noes 170.
1017§ Question accordingly negatived.
§ Mr. Alan Meale (Mansfield)On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. Will you reconsider yet again your decision to invoke Standing Order No. 39? As I recall, the last time that that was invoked was in 1979— [Interruption.]
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. The hon. Gentleman should be heard.
§ Mr. MealeOn that occasion, 13 votes had already taken place. Surely we have not yet reached that stage in these proceedings.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerI entered the House considerably earlier than 1979; and if the hon. Gentleman looks back he will find other precedents. In any case, we have already had 10 Divisions.
§ Dr. Norman A. Godman (Greenock and Port Glasgow)On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. Is it your intention to invoke standing order No. 39 in respect of motion No. 19, which concerns the controversial issue of the common organisation of the market in potatoes, because I am keen to register a vote agin it?
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. One at a time.
§ Mr. BennettOn a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. I do not want to pursue the question of your ruling, but I would like you to explain how you will implement your ruling, to protect the rights—
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. I am quite happy to do that when the time comes.
§ Mr. BennettFurther to that point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker—
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. Mr. Skinner.
§ Mr. Dennis Skinner (Bolsover)On the few occasions that Standing Order No. 39 has been invoked since 1970—although that has happened recently—I have been present. The occupant of the Chair invoked the Standing Order only when there were seven, 10 or a dozen hon. Members in the Chamber. On no occasion were 30 or 40 hon. Members voting—not while I have been here. On the last occasion that I recall, when we were up most of the night, only a handful of hon. Members were voting. It was relatively easy for the occupant of the Chair to see the numbers involved clearly. To do it on the basis of—
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. I regret that the hon. Gentleman's memory is not perhaps as good as it used to be. Mr. Harry Barnes.
§ Mr. Skinnerrose—
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. In the 1986–87 Session, voting in the last three Divisions before the Standing Order was invoked was 167 to 32, 166 to 31, and 166 to 31.
§ Mr. Skinnerrose—
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. That is the same scale—
§ Mr. SkinnerYou are wrong.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. Mr. Barnes.
§ Mr. Harry Barnes (Derbyshire, North-East)On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker—[Interruption.]
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. I ask hon. Members to contain themselves. Points of order from any part the House are important.
§ Mr. BarnesOn a point of order. Mr. Deputy Speaker. I seek your further ruling in respect of the point of order raised by my hon. Friend the Member for Greenock and Port Glasgow (Dr. Godman) in respect of motion No. 19. Initially, that motion was considered by European Standing Committee A and, in a Division, the voting was four votes to two.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerI have already told the House that I will consider each motion on its merits. We have reached motion No. 11; we are nowhere near motion No. 19.
§ Mr. Campbell-SavoursOn a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. You said that you would consider each order on its merits. As an individual Member of Parliament, I ask you to provide a procedure whereby my name is recorded as being in favour of the next order. "Erskine May" states:
Neither names nor numbers of a minority are now announced, though the numbers appear in the Journal.That would be insufficient to indicate that I voted in favour of the order about the nuclear power industry. I appeal to you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, to allow a Division so that Hansard can show that I voted in favour of the valuation order as it relates to the Scottish nuclear industry.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerI hear the hon. Gentleman's appeal, but I regret to say that I cannot meet it.
§ Mr. BennettOn a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. May I ask you to consider how to ensure that there is sufficient time for hon. Members to get into the Chamber to express their views—as is their right—and that thal is made clear on the Annunciator? Each order deals with a different subject, and an hon. Member may well decide not to vote on, for instance, the Scottish rating and valuation motions but to vote on the social security motions, or the motion relating to potatoes. You have a duty to protect the rights of Back Benchers, who rely on the Annunciator to know what is going on in the Chamber.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerI am grateful to the hon. Gentleman. However, 15 minutes have elapsed since I announced the position, and I assume that most—indeed, all—hon. Members now know what is going on.
I shall now put the Question on motion No. 11. The Question is—
§ Mr. Campbell-SavoursOn a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerI hope that it is a new point of order.
§ Mr. Campbell-SavoursIt really—
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. Is this a new point of order?
§ Mr. Campbell-SavoursNo, it is not.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerIn that case, I shall put the Question on motion No. 11.
Motion made, and Question put forthwith pursuant to Standing Order No. 101(5) (Standing Committees on Statutory Instruments, &c.).
That the draft Scottish Nuclear Limited (Rateable Values) (Scotland) Order 1993, which was laid before this House on 15th February, be approved.—[Mr. Arbuthnot]As many as are of that opinion say Aye—[HoN. MEMBERS: "No."] Order. In my opinion, the Division has been called unnecessarily. I therefore call on hon. Members supporting the motion to rise in their places. Will those against the motion do the same?
§ Mr. BennettOn a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. There is no point of order for me.
§ Mr. BennettHon. Members are still coming in.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerWill those who are voting No please stand? They have to be counted. Will hon. Members please stand still?
§ Mr. MealeOn a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. A major difficulty has occurred because of your ruling on this Division. We on this side of the House clearly heard the words from your lips, "Clear the Lobbies." That being the case, hon. Members on this side of the House must be allowed to vote through the Lobby.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerI gave adequate warning. The difficulty is that the House is not used to this procedure.
§ Mr. MealeFurther to that point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. We should like you to reconsider your ruling. The reason is that, when you uttered the words, "Clear the Lobbies", hon. Members left the Chamber and went into the Lobby, following which the Division bells sounded. Those hon. Members remained in the Lobby and missed the vote. Some of them went to other parts of the House. We ask for a further ruling.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerHon. Members make their own decisions. I made very clear what procedure I was to invoke. That procedure is laid down in the Standing Orders of the House.
§ Mr. Don Dixon (Jarrow)rose—
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. When I have finished one ruling I shall be happy to take another point of order. [Interruption.] Order. Let me announce the result of that Division. In my opinion, the Ayes have it.
§ Mr. DixonOn a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. On that occasion, you definitely said, "Clear the Lobbies." The Division bells rang and it went on the Annunciator. Then my hon. Friends went into the Lobby. May I ask you how many voted Aye? No one took any account of those who stood in favour of the motion, although the Clerks counted those who voted against it. How can you have a proper Division when there are no Tellers?
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerThe Clerk's responsibility is to count the minority, which he did. On this occasion it was the Noes. It may be the Ayes on a future occasion. The Clerk undertook that responsibility and reported the result to me. [Interruption.] Order. In my judgment, the Noes 1020 were so far below the Ayes that the motion was accepted. [Interruption.] I do not need to count. It was quite clear that there was a majority in favour of that motion.
§ Mr. Nigel Spearing (Newham, South)On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. I think that all of us in the Chamber, particularly those of us who have held chairs in various capacities, understand the difficulties that you face today—as well as the difficulties that some hon. Members might face in the next three days, difficulties that could have been relieved. Am I right in thinking that the procedure under the Standing Order is that the request to stand takes place on the second call after two minutes? Will you please confirm that? May I suggest that the difficulties that we have just experienced were caused by the fact that many of my hon. Friends—and nearly myself —did not understand that the moment to stand, if there was to be standing, was then and not earlier?
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerI think that the hon. Gentleman was in the Chamber when I explained that I proposed to invoke Standing Order No. 39. I spelt out the implications, and the record will show that I did. The fact that hon. Members are perhaps not aware of how Standing Order No. 39 works is not a matter for the Chair. I ask hon. Members to pay proper attention to announcements from the Chair.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerFor the sake of clarification, and to ensure that there is no further confusion or misunderstanding, Standing Order No. 39, for those who —[Interruption.] Order. Will the hon. Member for Denton and Reddish (Mr. Bennett) do me the courtesy of listening? Standing Order No. 39 states:
Mr. Speaker or the chairman may, after the lapse of two minutes, if in his opinion the division is unnecessarily claimed, take the vote of the House, or committee, by calling upon the Members who support, and who challenge his decision, successively to rise in their places; and he shall thereupon, as he thinks fit, either declare the determination of the House or committee, or name tellers for a division.
§ Mrs. Ann Taylor (Dewsbury)On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. May I ask for clarification? I was working in my office when the Division bells rang. The Annunciator clearly stated that there was a Division in the House, and the bells were ringing for everyone to hear. There was no way that any hon. Members working in their offices could know that they had to be in the House immediately to stand up at the appropriate time.
That meant that hon. Members who were working in their offices when the Division was called thought that they had the usual eight minutes in which to come to the Chamber. I seek your guidance on how hon. Members in that situation were supposed to know that the Division was being called on the Floor of the House in an unusual way.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerThe hon. Lady will be aware that I gave full warning 15 minutes before calling the Division.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. How can I give a proper answer to the hon. Lady if other hon. Members rise?
I gave full warning 15 minutes prior to calling the Division what the procedure would be and when I would invoke it. Hon. Members are required to keep abreast of 1021 what is happening here. They must use their judgment about whether to leave the Chamber to work. My judgment is to give due warning, which I did to the best of my ability.
§ Mr. MealeFurther to that point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. May I crave your indulgence for a second or two? Is it part of the procedure in such cases, when Standing Order No. 39 is invoked, to say, "Clear the Lobbies" and to call a Division?
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerYes, it is. If I say, "Clear the Lobbies", that is part of the required procedure. I must follow the procedure of the House as laid down by the Standing Orders. I have no room for discretion in that matter. My discretion concerns whether I announce the Tellers.
§ Mr. Derek Fatchett (Leeds, Central)On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. I seek clarification on how you weighed the votes for the Division. I think that the responsibility of the Chair in these circumstances is to protect the minority from those who try to shout us down. The point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker, is this: those of us who voted No were asked to stand in our positions here. You then said that you thought that the Noes were a minority. May I say how impressed I am by your clairvoyance and perception, because nobody stood on the other side. How do you know—
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. I did ask the Ayes—those who supported the motion—to stand, and all the hon. Members whom I can see on the Government side of the Chamber stood, and some Opposition Members, too. Then I called the Noes. After a delay, the Noes stood and were counted by the Clerk—[HON. MEMBERS: "How many?"]. It was clear where the majority lay. [HON. MEMBERS: "How many?"] Thirty-four.
§ Question agreed to.
§
Resolved,
That the draft Scottish Nuclear Limited (Rateable Values) (Scotland) Order 1993, which was laid before this House on 15th February, be approved.
Motion made, and Question put forthwith pursuant to Standing Order No. 101(5) (Standing Committees on Statutory Instruments, &c.),
That the draft Scottish Power plc. (Rateable Values) (Scotland) Order 1993, which was laid before this House on 15th February, be approved.—[Mr. Arbuthnot.]
§ The House proceeded to a Division—
§ Mr. DixonOn a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker —[HON. MEMBERS: "Where is the hat?"] On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. [HON. MEMBERS: "Where is the hat?"' On a point of—[HON. MEMBERS: "This is during a Division."] I rose on a point of order before the Division was called—[HON. MEMBERS: "No."]
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. I regret to say that I did not hear the hon. Gentleman's point of order before I called the motion—[Interruption.]—but I shall take the point of order now, if the hon. Gentleman wishes to raise it and it follows the procedure of the House. The Question has been put, so I should be grateful if the hon. Member would follow the procedures of the House and wear—[Interruption.]
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. I am happy to give guidance if the hon. Gentleman will follow the procedure of the House.
§ Mr. Eric Illsley (Barnsley, Central)(seated and covered): On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. You will be aware that the Procedure Committee recently recommended that, when there was an alteration during a Division—[HON. MEMBERS: "What? An altercation?"]—
when there was an alteration to procedure during a Division, a message should be shown on the Annunciator. I am referring to what happens when a Division is extended.
In those circumstances, it was recommended that some message should be displayed on the Annunciator to show hon. Members such as my hon. Friend the Member for Dewsbury (Mrs. Taylor) who are coming to the Chamber from outside the precincts of the Palace of Westminster that they have extra time in which to vote. My suggestion is that perhaps it would be better for the House to be suspended for sufficient time to allow for hon. Members in and about the Palace of Westminster—
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. The hon. Gentleman will be aware that that procedure is primarily for security alerts and other events of that nature.
Motion No. 12. As many as are of the opinion say Aye. to the contrary No. Clear the Lobbies.
§ Mr. Meale(seated and covered): On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. For the benefit of hon. Members in the Chamber, will you tell us: is this a Division? Are Members going into the Division Lobbies or not?
§ Mr. Deputy Speaker"Clear the Lobbies" means clear the Lobbies of strangers. Hon. Members have had it explained to them several times that, if they wish to take part in the Division—which is entirely voluntary—they should remain in their places. After two minutes, if I believe it appropriate, I shall either call the Tellers, in which case there will be a normal Division, or I shall ask Members to rise in their places.
Mr. DEPUTY SPEAKER, having said that it appeared to him that the Division had been unnecessarily claimed, accordingly called upon the Members who supported and who challenged his decision successively to rise in their places, and he declared that the Ayes had it, forty-two Members only who challenged his decision having stood up.
Question accordingly agreed to.
§ Mr. DixonOn a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. Would you explain the procedure under Standing Order No. 39 because there seems to be a lot of confusion, not among Opposition Members, but among Conservative Members? How will you tell whether there is a consistent vote if the vote for the Noes is not declared at the end of each vote? May we be given the number of those voting against at the end of each vote, and can that be put on the Annunciator so that people outside know that there is a Division and how many are voting against the motion?
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerThe House is entitled to know that 42 hon. Members voted against the motion.
§ Mr. Martin Redmond (Don Valley)On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. I ask for clarification. I am sure that it would be helpful if the Clerks stood to count hon. Members. They remain seated, so they must have difficulty in counting. I understand that to challenge the 1023 count made by the Clerks would be to challenge your decision, Mr. Deputy Speaker and obviously I do not want to do that. However, while the Clerks remain seated, there is a possibility that they will miscount.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerThe House has experienced Clerks, and I think that we can rely on their ability to count.
§ Mr. Thomas Graham (Renfrew, West and Inverclyde)On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker—[Interruption.] I shall put my point of order if hon. Members stop baying. It is difficult for folk like me who have a hearing aid to hear everything in the Chamber when there is such noise. Hon. Members who, like myself, suffer from that disability will be helped by other hon. Members keeping quiet when they raise a point of order. I was moving so fast that my wife could not have counted me. How you could you count me, Mr. Deputy Speaker?
Motion made, and Question put forthwith pursuant to Standing Order No. 101(5)(Standing Committees on Statutory Instruments, &c.),
That the draft Water Undertakings (Rateable Values) (Scotland) Order 1993, which was laid before this House on 15th February, be approved.—[Mr. Arbuthnot.]The House proceeded to a Division—
§ Mr. Campbell-SavoursOn a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. Will you confirm—
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. Where is the hat?
§ Mr. SkinnerHe does not need a hat.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. Where is the proper hat?
§ Mr. Campbell-SavoursWill you confirm, Mr. Deputy Speaker—
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. The House insists on hats. There is one at either end of the Chamber.
§ Mr. SkinnerHis head has only got to be covered.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. The hat must be on.
§ Mr. Campbell-SavoursWhere does it say that 1 must wear a hat? Which page?
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. I ask the hon. Gentleman to wear a hat.
§ Mr. SkinnerHe does not have to.
§ Mr. Campbell-SavoursMr. Deputy Speaker, will you confirm—
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerI call upon those supporting the motion to rise in their places. I call upon those opposing the motion to rise in their places.
§ Mr. BennettOn a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerOrder. The hon. Gentleman must sit down.
Question agreed to.
§ Mr. BennettOn a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. As I understood the rules, an hon. Member has to be covered. I understood that the recommendation from the Select Committee on Procedure was to provide the House with two hats but, because many hon. Members felt that it was not dignified to wear a hat like that, an hon. Member was entitled simply to have his head covered. I understand that it was custom and practice for an hon. Member to put an Order Paper on his head. If you can direct us to where it says that an hon. Member has to wear one of the hats as opposed to covering his head, I shall be grateful.
§ Mrs. Ann TaylorOn a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. There seems to be great concern in the Chamber about the way in which proceedings are developing. Would it be appropriate for Madam Speaker to be asked to come to the Chamber so that we might have proper rulings on these matters?
§ Mr. RedmondOn a further point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. You will be aware that Madam Speaker's predecessor allowed the practice of an hon. Member covering his head with an Order Paper. Has there been a change of practice?
§ Mr. Michael Connarty (Falkirk, East)On a further point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. My point of order is much more simple. In the year that I have been in the House, I have not heard three consecutive points of order go unanswered. It seems strange that we have a new procedure in the House. I have heard Madam Speaker say that she will answer one point of order before another is taken. We now have three points of order outstanding without an answer.
§ Mr. Deputy SpeakerMy understanding is that the Select Committee on Procedure said that a hat should be worn. As the hon. Member for Workington (Mr. Campbell-Savours) was provided with a hat, courtesy to the Chair suggests that he should have worn it.