§ 3.42 p.m.
§ Mr. John Parker (Dagenham)I beg to move,
That leave be given to bring in a Bill to amend the law relating to public entertainments on Sundays.This is a limited Bill. It is not a Sunday trading Bill, and it excludes Scotland and Northern Ireland, which have their own laws on the subject.Similar Bills passed through Committee three times in the last Parliament, in 1967 through the House of Lords and in 1968 and 1969 through the House of Commons. It failed to become law because of a filibuster against it, in 1968 on Report and in 1969 at the Committee stage. In 1969 60 hours and 19 Sittings were spent on the Bill before it finally went through Committee. It got through substantially as it started despite the filibuster.
In moving the Bill, I am seeking the views of the new House. There are over 150 new Members, largely younger Members of a new generation. I hope that they will feel that this is a worthy Bill that they can support.
The House of Commons is behind public opinion on this matter. The latest Gallup Poll of adults over the age of 16 showed 64 per cent. of people in England in favour of the Bill, and 62 per cent. in Wales. Of those between 16 and 24, 82 per cent. were for it; of those between 25 and 44, 71 per cent., and of those between 45 and 64, 59 per cent. Only in the older age group of those over 65 was a majority against the Bill.
The case for the Bill is that the present law is a complete mess. It is based very largely on the 1780 Act, with various exceptions for concerts and, in many areas of the country, for cinemas. The 1780 Act is enforced sporadically and sometimes abused, being got round through subterfuges of one kind or another.
The vital Clause is that providing that people may not pay for entry to an entertainment on Sunday. That is illegal under the 1780 Act, but the law is got round in many ways, and by many reputable organisations. For example, county cricket has been saved by Sunday play. The law is got round by having payments 1713 for programmes or parking. The same is true of Rugby League and polo.
Motor racing at Brands Hatch on Sundays was ruled illegal in a test case brought by the Lord's Day Observance Society against the organisation running it. By dropping payment for entry and introducing parking fees the organisation has been able to continue its activity.
Theatre performances are illegal on Sunday. Many people think it rather ridiculous that we can see a live play on television on a Sunday but cannot see it in a theatre. But theatre clubs can be created, and members can there see a live performance on Sundays.
The proposed change in the law is backed by all the major sports organisations, including the Football Association, the Football League, the British Amateur Athletics Board, the M.C.C., the Rugby League Authorities, the R.A.C. and many other bodies. Rugby Union games are now being played in Sundays.
There is no proposal that theatres should be open seven days a week. If they gave performances on Sunday they would close on Monday or another day. The younger actors and actresses are almost universally in favour of such a change, as are most of the stalwarts of the theatre, like Dame Sybil Thorndike and Dame Edith Evans. They believe that in the interests of the theatre it should be possible to give performances on Sunday, when an audience is more likely to be available.
The noise argument has been one of the main obstacles to passing such a Bill. There is a fear that noise would be connected with Sunday football. To meet that point the Home Office drew up a Clause to meet the wishes of local authorities and magistrates, which would enable objection to be taken by people living in the neighbourhood of a sports stadium to noise on Sundays, and for action to be taken to regulate Sunday activities or prevent them at a particular stadium. It is most unlikely that first-class football would be played by the same club on both Saturdays and Sundays. Local circumstances would determine whether it played on Saturday or Sunday in any area.
The Bill is in no sense anti-religious. It is backed by leaders of most of the responsible religious organisations, which Vol. 812 1714 dislike the present hypocritical position. They feel that the present law brings law enforcement into disrepute and that it is much better to alter it and bring it into line with popular feeling than, to have subterfuges to get round it.
The only serious opposition comes from a fanatical Sabbatarian organisation, which is very well-organised and is one of the best pressure groups in the House, the Lord's Day Observance Society and its friends. Its members have every right to whatever views they like on how to spend their Sunday, but no right to force their views on the rest of us who do not agree with them.
In this year of grace, given that we have people in this country of all religious views and none, the right thing to do is to have a law in accord with what the majority think, a law which allows people to choose for themselves how to spend their Sundays.
I therefore ask the House to support the Bill, to enable every one of our people to choose for themselves how they will spend their Sundays.
§ 3.42 p.m.
§ Mr. Ron Lewis (Carlisle)I oppose the Motion. Over the years my hon. Friend the Member for Dagenham (Mr. Parker) has been consistent in his desire to extend the provision of Sunday entertainment, but so far without success.
Let me make it perfectly clear that I am in no way associated with the Lord's Day Observance Society. My only connection with it is that, like other hon. Members, I receive its circulars from time to time, and many of them land up in the wastepaper basket.
Neither am I speaking for any body of Church opinion, though it is safe to say that the majority of religious denominations in Britain are violently opposed to my hon. Friend's Bill. I hope that hon. Members who believe and feel as I do will demonstrate their opposition to the Measure in the Lobby.
The laws governing Sunday observance have two distinct aims. The first, and most important, is to protect the distinctive character of the day—of Sunday as opposed to the other days of the week. The second is the need to defend the worker's day of rest. 1715 A campaign for an extension of the present laws has been going on in certain quarters, particularly in the Press. Hon. Members who dare oppose the Bill will no doubt be labelled killjoys and branded sarcastically as "do-gooders" who are seeking to curtail the pleasures of others. But we should be prepared to defend Sunday against further secularisation and commercialisation from a patriotic sense of duty as the trustees of posterity.
If by our actions we pass on to the next generation a de-Christianised Sunday, they will pass on a de-Christianised Britain. It will be easier for us and them to defend Sunday with religion behind it than it will be for our children to defend religion without Sunday on which to practise it.
The Church, which seeks to retain Sunday, is composed of people and not merely institutions run by parsons, important though they are. I am not, in my opposition to the Bill, simply advocating that people should go to church on Sunday, though if more did and if more children went to Sunday school we might have fewer people in the courts.
One day of the week should be set aside from the rest, and that should be Sunday, the Sabbath day, with its restful quietude. It is a valuable asset. If this extension of Sunday entertainments is approved, the peace and quiet of Sunday will be disturbed in most towns and cities and this will be greatly resented, particularly by those who live in the vicinity of sporting events.
§ Most hon. Members will be aware that in my constituency we have the most progressive football team of the last five years. I support it whenever I can. I cannot be certain, but I do not think it would be the wish of the directors of that team to upset the peace and quiet of the neighbourhood and antagonise many of my constituents by an extension of sporting facilities on Sundays.
§ It is becoming almost immoral nowadays to talk about moral problems. I believe that my hon. Friend's proposals raise certain moral issues. For example, a nation which seeks to neglect its Sabbath responsibilities of rest and worship for commercial ventures is travelling along the road to seeming disaster.
§ In the last few years we have seen an extension of what is now known as the permissive society. A great many people in these islands, irrespective of politics, religion and creed, are becoming restive about moral values and standards. Like me, they believe that an extension of Sunday entertainments would not help us in any way.
§ I plead with hon. Members to accept that Sunday is a precious heritage of immense value. Let us value it to the full by seeking to retain the character of the day. If I am able to get a Teller to stand with me. I shall divide the House.
§ Question put, pursuant to Standing Order No.13 (Motions for leave to bring in Bills and nomination of Select Committees at commencement of Public Business):—
§ The House divided: Ayes 113, Noes 116.
1717| Division No. 226.] | AYES | [3.56 p.m. |
| Allason, James (Hemel Hempstead) | Delargy, H. J. | Griffiths, Will (Exchange) |
| Allaun, Frank (Salford, E.) | Dell, Rt. Hn. Edmund | Grimond, Rt. Hn. J. |
| Allen, Scholefield | Doig, Peter | Hamilton, William (Fife, W.) |
| Archer, Jeffrey (Louth) | Douglas-Mann, Bruce | Harper, Joseph |
| Bagier, Gordon A. T. | Driberg, Tom | Haselhurst, Alan |
| Balniel, Lord | Duffy, A. E. P. | Healey, Rt. Hn. Denis |
| Blenkinsop, Arthur | Dykes, Hugh | Heffer, Eric S. |
| Bottomley, Rt. Hn. Arthur | Edwards, Nicholas (Pembroke) | Houghton, Rt. Hn. Douglas |
| Brocklebank-Fowler, Christopher | English, Michael | Howell, Denis (Small Heath) |
| Brown, Ronald (Shoreditch & F'bury) | Fisher,Mrs.Doris(B'ham,Ladywood) | Huckfield, Leslie |
| Carmichael, Neil | Fitch, Alan (Wigan) | Hughes, Robert (Aberdeen, N.) |
| Chapman, Sydney | Fletcher, Raymond (Ilkeston) | Hunt, John |
| Clark, David (Colne Valley) | Fletcher, Ted (Darlington) | Irvine,Rt.Hn.SirArthur(Edge Hill) |
| Cocks, Michael (Bristol, S.) | Foley, Maurice | James, David |
| Coombs, Derek | Foot, Michael | Jenkins, Rt. Hn. Roy (Stechford) |
| Cooper, A. E. | Ford, Ben | Johnson, James (K'ston-on-Hull, W.) |
| Crawshaw, Richard | Fraser,Rt.Hn.Hugh(St'Bord & Stone) | Johnson, Walter (Derby, S.) |
| Cronin, John | Fraser, John (Norwood) | Judd, Frank |
| Cunningham, G. (Islington, S.W.) | Garrett, W. E. | Kinnock, Neil |
| Dalyell, Tam | Gilbert, Dr. John | Kinsey, J. R. |
| Davies, G. Elfed (Rhondda, E.) | Ginsburg, David | Lamond, James |
| Davis, Clinton (Hackney, C.) | Grant, George (Morpeth) | Latham, Arthur |
| Deakins, Eric | Grant, John D. (Islington, E.) | Lestor, Miss Joan |
| Lewis, Arthur (W. Ham N.) | Murray, R. K. | Skinner, Dennis |
| Lipton, Marcus | Oram, Bert | Spriggs, Leslie |
| Lyons, Edward (Bradford, E.) | Orbach, Maurice | Stewart, Rt. Hn. Michael (Fulham) |
| Mabon, Dr. J. Dickson | Orme, Stanley | Strang, Gavin |
| McCartney, Hugh | Paget, R. T. | Strauss, Rt. Hn. G. R. |
| McCrindle, R. A. | Palmer, Arthur | Taverne, Dick |
| McGuire, Michael | Parkinson, Cecil (Enfield, W.) | Torney, Tom |
| McMillan, Tom (Glasgow, C.) | Pavitt, Laurie | Varley, Eric G. |
| McNamara, J. Kevin | Peart, Rt. Hn. Fred | Vickers, Dame Joan |
| Mallalieu, J. P. W.(Huddersfield, E.) | Prescott, John | Wallace, George |
| Marks, Kenneth | Rodgers, William (Stockton-on-Tees) | Watkins, David |
| Meacher, Michael | Rost, Peter | Whitehead, Phillip |
| Mellish, Rt. Hn. Robert | Sheldon, Robert (Ashton-under-Lyne) | |
| Mendelson, John | Silkin, Hn. S. C. (Dulwich) | TELLERS FOR THE AYES: |
| Morris, Alfred (Wythenshawe) | Sillars, James | Mr. John Parker and |
| Mulley, Rt. Hn. Frederick | Silverman, Julius | Mr. Dick Leonard. |
| NOES | ||
| Archer, Peter (Rowley Regis) | Hiley, Joseph | Page, John (Harrow, W.) |
| Bell, Ronald | Hughes, Rt. Hn. Cledwyn (Anglesey) | Pardoe, John |
| Benyon, W. | Hutchison, Michael Clark | Percival, Ian |
| Bidwell, Sydney | Jennings, J. C. (Burton) | Pike, Miss Mervyn |
| Biggs-Davison, John | Jessel, Toby | Pink, R. Bonner |
| Booth, Albert | John, Brynmor | Pounder, Rafton |
| Boscawen, Robert | Jones, Arthur (Northants, S.) | Powell, Rt. Hn. J. Enoch |
| Boyd-Carpenter, Rt. Hn. John | Jones, Gwynoro (Carmarthen) | Price, J. T. (Westhoughton) |
| Braine, Bernard | Kellett, Mrs. Elaine | Probert, Arthur |
| Bray, Ronald | Kilfedder, James | Ramsden, Rt. Hn. James |
| Brown, Bob ((N'c'tle-upon-Tyne,W.) | Knight, Mrs. Jill | Reed, Laurance (Bolton, E.) |
| Brown, Sir Edward (Bath) | Lane, David | Renton, Rt. Hn. Sir David |
| Burden, F. A. | Legge-Bourke, Sir Harry | Rhodes, Geoffrey |
| Campbell, Rt.Hn.G.(Moray&Nairn) | Lewis, Kenneth (Rutland) | Rhys Williams, Sir Brandon |
| Chichester-Clark, R. | Loughlin, Charles | Roberts, Albert (Normanton) |
| Clark, William (Surrey, E.) | Lyon, Alexander W. (York) | Roberts,Rt.Hn.Goronwy(Caernarvon) |
| Cohen, Stanley | McAdden, Sir Stephen | Roberts, Wyn (Conway) |
| Coleman, Donald | McBride, Neil | Roderick, Caerwyn E.(Br'c'n&R'dnor) |
| Cordle, John | Maginnis, John E. | Sandys, Rt. Hn. D. |
| Costain, A. P. | Marten, Neil | Soref, Harold |
| Davies, Denzil (Llanelly) | Mather, Carol | Stewart, Donald (Western Isles) |
| Davies, Ifor (Gower) | Mawby, Ray | Stoddart-Scott, Col. Sir M. |
| Davies, S. O. (Merthyr Tydvil) | Mills, Peter (Torrington) | Summerskill, Hn. Dr. Shirley |
| Dempsey, James | Mills, Stratton (Belfast, N.) | Taylor,Edward M.(G'gow,Cathcart) |
| Dodds-Parker, Douglas | Milne, Edward (Blyth) | Temple, John M. |
| Edwards, William (Merioneth) | Mitchell,Lt.-Col.C.(Aberdeenshire,W) | Thomas,Rt.Hn.George (Cardiff,W.) |
| Elliot, Capt. Walter (Carshalton) | Moate, Roger | Tinn, James |
| Evans, Fred | Molyneaux, James | Trew, Peter |
| Eyre, Reginald | Money, Ernie | Turton, Rt. Hn. R. H. |
| Farr, John | Monro, Hector | Urwin, T. W. |
| Ferryhough, Rt. Hn. E. | Morgan-Giles, Rear-Adm. | Waddington, David |
| Galbraith, Hn. T. G. | Morris, Charles R. (Openshaw) | Wainwright, Edwin |
| Galpern, Sir Myer | Morris, Rt. Hn. John (Aberavon) | Wall, Patrick |
| Gibson-Watt, David | Mudd, David | Ward, Dame Irene |
| Glyn, Dr. Alan | Murton, Oscar | Wells, John (Maidstone) |
| Gray, Hamish | Nabarro, Sir Gerald | Wolrige-Gordon, Patrick |
| Gurden, Harold | Normanton, Tom | |
| Hamilton, Michael (Salisbury) | Orr, Capt. L. P. S. | TELLERS FOR THE NOES: |
| Hardy, Peter | Oswald, Thomas | Mr. Ron Lewis and |
| Harrison, Col, Sir Harwood (Eye) | Owen, Idris (Stockport, N.) | Mr. Simon Mahon. |