§ Again considered in Committee.
§ Mr. ParkinI hope that what I was saying will be within the recollection of the Committee, because I should hate to have to go through it all again, in a struggle to convince you, Sir William, of the innocence of my intentions. The hon. Lady the Parliamentary Secretary was making a point which in the circumstances was exceptionally unfair. Even if there were such a fund and these payments had been invested in it—as they have not—there is no difference whatever. Money paid in one generation budget into the Exchequer and invested in some form, in schools, hospitals or what not, is part of the budget of the day. This is part of the scheme which guarantees that in later years Parliament will provide—but it can only provide from the taxation of the year—certain benefits.
That is the whole basis in every insurance scheme, and it is safeguarded by the little Clause, printed in italics, which appears in every such Bill. I do not think it fair of the hon. Lady to select this particular category of widows and to say that they are not sustained by National Insurance contributions when neither they nor anyone else is. It is fair to assume that the benefit promised when the con- 563 tributions were made should now be increased by nominal money values to offset some of the loss sustained during the decline in the value of money.
§ Question put, That those words be there inserted:—
§ The Committee divided: Ayes 142, Noes 177.
565| Division No. 44.] | AYES | [10.4 p.m. |
| Abse, Leo | Griffiths, Rt. Hon. James (Llanelly) | Price, J. T. (Westhoughton) |
| Ainsley, William | Hale, Leslie (Oldham, w.) | Probert, Arthur |
| Allaun, Frank (Salford, E.) | Hamilton, William (West Fife) | Pursey, Cmdr. Harry |
| Allen, Scholefield (Crewe) | Hannan, William | Redhead, E. C. |
| Awbory, Stan (Bristol, Central) | Harper, Joseph | Rhodes, H. |
| Bacon, Miss Alice | Hayman, F. H. | Roberts, Albert (Normanton) |
| Barnett, Guy | Henderson,Rt.Hn.Arthur(Rwly Regis) | Robertson, John (Paisley) |
| Beaney, Alan | Herbison, Miss Margaret | Robinson, Kenneth (St. Pancras, N.) |
| Bence, Cyril | Hill, J. (Midlothian) | Rodgars, W. T. (Stockton) |
| Bennett, J. (Glasgow, Bridge ton) | Holman, Percy | Ross, William |
| Blyton, William | Holt, Arthur | Short, Edward |
| Boardman, H. | Hooson, H. E. | Silverman, Julius (Aston) |
| Bowen, Roderic (Cardigan) | Houghton, Douglas | Silverman, Sydney (Nelson) |
| Braddock, Mrs. E. M. | Howell, Denis (Small Heath) | Slater, Mrs. Harriet (Stoke, N.) |
| Broughton, Dr. A. D. D. | Hynd, H. (Accrington) | Slater, Joseph (Sedgefield) |
| Brown, Thomas (Ince) | Hynd, John (Attercliffe) | small, William |
| Callaghan, James | Irving, Sydney (Dartford) | Smith, Ellis (Stoke, S.) |
| Carmichael, Nell | Jay, Rt. Hon. Douglas | Sorensen, R. W. |
| Castle, Mrs. Barbara | Jeger, George | Soskice, Rt. Hon. Sir Frank |
| Cliffe, Michael | Jones, Dan (Burnley) | Spriggs, Leslie |
| Collick, Percy | Jones, Elwyn (West Ham, S.) | Steel, Thomas |
| Corbet, Mrs. Freda | Kelley, Richard | Stewart, Michael (Fulham) |
| Craddock, George (Bradford, S.) | King, Dr. Horace | Stones, William |
| Cullen, Mrs. Alice | Lawson, George | Swain, Thomas |
| Dalyell, Tam | Lee, Frederick (Newton) | Taverne, D. |
| Davies, G. Elfed (Rhondda, E.) | Lee, Miss Jennie (Cannock) | Taylor, Bernard (Mansfield) |
| Davies, Ifor (Gower) | Lever, L. M. (Ardwick) | Thomas, George (Cardiff, W.) |
| Davies, S. O. (Merthyr) | Lewis, Arthur (West Ham, N.) | Thomas, Iorwerth (Rhondda, W.) |
| Deer, George | Loughlin, Charles | Thompson, Dr. Alan (Dunfermline) |
| Dempsey, James | Lubbock, Eric | Thornton, Ernest |
| Diamond, John | McKay, John (Wallsend) | Tomney, Frank |
| Dodds, Norman | MacMillan, Malcolm (Western Isles) | Wade, Donald |
| Driberg, Tom | Macpherson, Malcolm (Stirling) | Wainwright, Edwin |
| Dugdale, Rt. Hon. John | Manuel, Archie | Warbey, William |
| Edwards, Rt. Hon. Ness (Caerphilly) | Mapp, Charles | Weitzman, David |
| Edwards, Robert (Bilston) | Mason, Roy | Whitlock, William |
| Edwards, Walter (Stepney) | Mendelson, J. J. | Wilkins, W. A. |
| Evans, Albert | Millan, Bruce | Williams, Ll. (Abertillery) |
| Fernyhough, E. | Milne, Edward | Williams, W. R. (Openshaw) |
| Finch, Harold | Mitchison, G. R. | Williams, W. T. (Warrington) |
| Fitch, Alan | Morris, John | Willis, E. G. (Edinburgh, E.) |
| Fletcher, Eric | Neal, Harold | Woodburn, Rt. Hon. A. |
| Forman, J. C. | Noel-Baker, Francis (Swindon) | Woof, Robert |
| Fraser, Thomas (Hamilton) | Oswald, Thomas | Yates, Victor (Ladywood) |
| Galpern, Sir Myer | Paget, R. T. | |
| George,LadyMeganLloyd(Crmrthn) | Parker, John | TELLERS FOR THE AYES: |
| Gourlay, Harry | Peart, Frederick | Mr. Charles A. Howell and |
| Greenwood, Anthony | Pentland, Norman | Mr. McCann. |
| Grey, Charles | Popplewell, Ernest | |
| NOES | ||
| Agnew, Sir Peter | Carr, Compton (Barons Court) | Duncan, Sir James |
| Aitken, W. T. | Carr, Robert (Mitcham) | Eden, John |
| Allason, James | Clark, Henry (Antrim, N.) | Elliot, Capt. Walter (Carshalton) |
| Ashton, Sir Hubert | Clarke, Brig. Terence(Portsmth, w.) | Elliott, R.W.(Nwcastle-upon-Tyne,N.) |
| Awdry, Daniel (Chippenham) | Cleaver, Leonard | Emery, Peter |
| Bainlel, Lord | Cooke, Robert | Errington, Sir Eric |
| Barter, John | Cooper, A. E. | Farr, John |
| Batsford, Brian | Cordeaux, Lt-Col. J. K. | Fell, Anthony |
| Baxter, Sir Beverley (Southgate) | Costain, A. P. | Finlay, Graeme |
| Beamish, Col. Sir Tufton | Coulson, Michael | Fletcher-Cooke, Charles |
| Bennett, F. M. (Torquay) | Courtney, Cdr. Anthony | Gammans, Lady |
| Bidgood, John C. | Crosthwaite-Eyre, Col. Sir Oliver | Gibson-Watt, David |
| Bitten, John | Curran, Charles | Gilmour, Ian (Norfolk Central) |
| Bigge-Davison, John | Currle, G. B. H. | Gilmour, Sir John (East Fife) |
| Bishop, F. P. | Dalkeith, Earl of | Glyn, Dr. Alan (Clapham) |
| Bourne-Arton, A. | Dance, James | Goodhart, Philip |
| Box, Donald | Deedes, Rt. Hon. W. F. | Goodhew, Victor |
| Braine, Bernard | Digby, Simon Wingfield | Gower, Raymond |
| Brewis, John | Donaldson, Cmdr. C. E. M. | Green, Alan |
| Brooke, Rt. Hon. Henry | Doughty, Charles | Gresham Cooke, R. |
| Billiard, Denys | Drayson, G. B. | Grosvenor, Lt.-Col. R. G. |
| Campbell, Gordon (Moray & Nairn) | du Cann, Edward | Gurden, Harold |
| Hamilton, Michael (Wellingborough) | Macmillan, Maurice (Halifax) | Skeet, T. H. H. |
| Harris, Reader (Heston) | Macpherson,Rt.Hn.Niall (Dumfries) | Smith, Dudley (Br'ntf'd & Chiswick) |
| Harvey, Sir Arthur Vere (Macclesf'd) | Maitland, Sir John | Smyth, Rt. Hon. Brig. Sir John |
| Harvey, John (Walthamstow, E.) | Marten, Neil | Speir, Rupert |
| Hastings, Stephen | Matthews, Gordon (Meriden) | Stoddart-Scott, Col. Sir Malcolm |
| Hay, John | Mawby, Ray | Storey, Sir Samuel |
| Heald, Rt. Hon. Sir Lionel | Maxwell-Hyslop, R. J. | Studholme, Sir Henry |
| Henderson, John (Cathcart) | Maydon, Lt.-cmdr. S. L. C. | Tapsell, Peter |
| Hill, Mrs. Eveline (Wythenshawe) | Mills, Stratton | Taylor, Edwin (Bolton, E.) |
| Hill, J. E. B. (S. Norfok) | Miscampbell, Norman | Taylor, Frank (M'ch'st'r, moss Side) |
| Hocking, Philip N. | Moore, Sir Thomas (Ayr) | Teeling, Sir William |
| Holland, Philip | More, Jasper (Ludlow) | Temple, John M. |
| Hopkins, Alan | Mott-Radclyffe, Sir Charles | Thatcher, Mrs. Margaret |
| Hornsby-Smith, Rt. Hon. Dame P. | Neave, Airey | Thomas, Sir Leslie (Canterbury) |
| Howard, John (Southampton, Teat) | Osborn, John (Hallam) | Thompson, Sir Kenneth (Walton) |
| Hughes-Young, Michael | Pannell, Norman (Kirkdale) | Thornton-Kemsley, Sir Colin |
| Iremonger, T. L. | Pearson, Frank (Clitheroe) | Tiley, Arthur (Bradford, W.) |
| Irvine, Bryant Godman (Rye) | Percival, Ian | Touche, Rt. Hon. Sir Gordon |
| James, David | Pickthorn, Sir Kenneth | Turner, Colin |
| Johnson, Dr. Donald (Carlisle) | Pilkington, Sir Richard | Turton, Rt. Hon. R. H. |
| Johnson, Eric (Blackley) | Pitt, Dame Edith | Tweedsmuir, Lady |
| Johnson Smith, Geoffrey | Pott, Percivall | van Straubenzee, W. R. |
| Jones, Arthur (Northants, S) | Powell, Rt. Hon. J. Enoch | Vane, W. M. F. |
| Kerr, Sir Hamilton | Prior, J. M. L. | Vaughan-Morgan, Rt. Hon. Sir John |
| Kirk, Peter | Prior-Palmer, Brig. Sir Otho | Vickers, Miss Joan |
| Langford-Holt, Sir John | Proudfoot, Wilfred | Wakefield, Sir Wavell |
| Leavey, J. A. | Pym, Francis | Wall, Patrick |
| Lilley, F. J. P. | Quennell, Miss J. M. | Wells, John (Maidstone) |
| Linstead, Sir Hugh | Rawlinson, Sir Peter | Williams, Dudley (Exeter) |
| Litchfield, Capt. John | Redmayne, Rt. Hon. Martin | Williams, Paul (Sunderland, S.) |
| Loveys, Walter H. | Rees, Hugh | Wilson, Geoffrey (Truro) |
| Lucas-Tooth, Sir Hugh | Renton, Rt. Hon. David | Wise, A. R. |
| MacArthur, Ian | Ridley, Hon. Nicholas | Wolrige-Gordon, Patrick |
| McLaren, Martin | Roberta, Sir Peter (Heeley) | Woollam, John |
| Maclay, Rt. Hon. John | Robinson, Rt. Hn. Sir R. (B'pool,S.) | Worsley, Marcus |
| McLean, Neil (Inverness) | Rodgers, John (Sevenoaks) | |
| Macleod, Rt. Hn. Iain (Enfield, W.) | Royle, Anthony (Richmond, Surrey) | TELLERS FOR THE NOES: |
| McMaster, Stanley R. | Shaw, M. | Mr. Peel and Mr. Ian Fraser. |
§ Schedule agreed to.