§ Mr. McGOVERN(by Private Notice) asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if his attention has been drawn to the sentence of 14 days' imprisonment passed on Thomas Hendry, Thomas Lavelle, Lawrence Cairns, Hugh Wilson, Thomas Beattie, Patrick Chance, and Hugh O'Neil at the Central Police Court, Glasgow, on 13th July, by Stipendiary Smith, for playing football in the street at St. Margarets Place, Near Bridge-gate; if he is aware that four of these boys were never in a court previously and that the other two were only once charged with the same kind of offence, that their ages range from 16 to 18 years of age, that they were arrested and kept in the cells at Central Police Office for the night and that they are now serving that sentence in Barlinnie Prison and will he consider the case with a view to the reduction of the sentence?
§ Sir G. COLLINSI am aware that the six lads referred to were tried and sentenced as stated. They were, however, charged, not with playing football in the street, but with conducting themselves in a disorderly manner while engaged in a game of football, and committing a breach of the peace. Evidence led at the trial indicated that they had been most disorderly and abusive, and that, although repeatedly warned by the police, their conduct for some time previously had evoked strong complaints from local residents. There is no ground to justify me in advising any interference with the sentence.
§ Mr. McGOVERNI would ask the right hon. Gentleman again to consider this case. Is he aware that two of these 1995 lads were in employment and that the employer of one of the boys refused to believe that the boy had been sent to prison for playing football, and was not prepared to take the boy back? Is he also aware that this boy is an orphan; does he think it right that a boy who has been left without his parents should now be in a Barlinnie Prison on a charge of this kind; and is he prepared to condone action of this kind—the sentencing to imprisonment of boys between 16 and 18? I consider it is a most disgraceful thing—
§ Sir G. COLLINSLet me remind the hon. Member that this is not a case of small children playing in the street. It is a case, so far as I can gather, I will not say of organised hooliganism, but of repeated offences caused to the local residents; and the local magistrate, having regard to the interests of the local residents, has taken the action mentioned by the hon. Member. In these circumstances, although I naturally regret that these young lads should have been sent to prison, where they have already stayed for a week, I am not in a position to remit the remainder of the sentence.
§ Mr. McGOVERNWhen the Secretary of State says that there have been repeated offences, is he aware that at least four of these boys have never been in trouble of any kind before in their lives; and, having regard to the fact that they are only 16 or 17 years of age, is he prepared to let them lie in prison and make criminals of them, merely for the boyish prank of playing football in the street? Is the right hon. Gentleman so callous as to allow boys of that age to remain in prison in these circumstances?
§ Sir G. COLLINSI wish to repeat in the strongest possible language that these boys were not sentenced for playing football in the street, but for being disorderly and abusive on several occasions, and, although the police have warned them repeatedly, they have, in the opinion of the police, become such a nuisance to the local residents that the magistrate has taken the course indicated in the hon. Member's question.
§ Mr. LAWSONIs the right hon. Gentleman aware that there is hardly a 1996 Member of this House who has not been guilty at some time or other of practically the same kind of conduct without even being summoned?
§ Sir G. COLLINSNaturally, this is a case which attracts the sympathy of every father in this House, and, when I addressed myself to this question, my sympathies were aroused. But when I went further and more fully into the matter, at the short notice placed at my disposal, I reluctantly came to the conclusion that it would be improper for me, having regard to all the facts of the case, no matter how my heart might desire to let the boys off, to act otherwise than I have done.
§ Mr. McGOVERNMay I ask the Secretary of State—
§ Mr. SPEAKERThe hon. Member has already put his question two or three times.
§ Mr. McGOVERNI consider that the conduct of the Secretary of State in this matter is of the most callous and brutal order. I consider that I am justified in protesting against this callous conduct and for the Member for Springburn (Mr. Emmott) to be "hear, hearing" it is an absolute disgrace.
§ Mr. SPEAKER rose—
§ Mr. McGOVERNI consider it is scandalous that boys should be allowed to lie in prison for the simple offence of playing football. [HON. MEMBERS: Order!"] I do not care one damn. It is brutal and damnable.
§ Mr. SPEAKERIf the hon. Member persists in conduct of that sort I shall have to deal with him very severely.
§ Mr. McGOVERNI do not care a damn what you do, Mr. Speaker.
§ Mr. SPEAKERThen I must name the hon. Member.
§ The LORD PRESIDENT of the COUNCIL (Mr. Baldwin)I beg to move,
That Mr. McGovern be suspended from the service of the House.
§ Question put.
§ The House divided: Ayes, 151; Noes, 24.
1997| Division No. 274.] | AYES. | [3.48 p.m. |
| Acland-Troyte, Lieut.-Colonel | Foot, Isaac (Cornwall, Bodmin) | Ormsby-Gore, Rt. Hon. William G. A. |
| Adams, Samuel Vyvyan T. (Leeds, W.) | Fox, Sir Gifford | Patrick, Colin M. |
| Agnew, Lieut.-Com. P. G. | Gilmour, Lt.-Col. Rt. Hon. Sir John | Pearson, William G. |
| Allen, Lt.-Col. J. Sandeman (B'k'nh'd.) | Gluckstein, Louis Halle | Petherick, M. |
| Anstruther-Gray, W. J. | Goldie, Noel B. | Peto, Sir Basil E. (Devon, Barnstaple) |
| Baillle, Sir Adrian W. M. | Goodman, Colonel Albert W. | Peto, Geoffrey K. (W'verh'pt'n, Blist'n) |
| Baldwin, Rt. Hon. Stanley | Grattan-Doyle, Sir Nicholas | Potter, John |
| Baldwin-Webb, Colonel J. | Grigg, Sir Edward | Powell, Lieut.-Col. Evelyn G. H. |
| Barclay-Harvey, C. M. | Grimston, R. V. | Ramsay, Capt. A. H. M. (Midlothian) |
| Beaumont, M. W. (Bucks., Aylesbury) | Harbord, Arthur | Ramsay, T. B. W. (Western Isles) |
| Beaumont, Hon. R.E.B. (Portsm'th, C.) | Harvey, George (Lambeth, Kenningt'n) | Ramebotham, Herwald |
| Benn, Sir Arthur Shirley | Headlam, Lieut.-Col. Cuthbert M. | Ray, Sir William |
| Borodale, Viscount | Henderson, Sir Vivian L. (Chelmsford) | Reid, William Allan (Derby) |
| Bossom, A. C. | Herbert, Capt. S. (Abbey Division) | Rentoul, Sir Gervals S. |
| Boulton, W. W. | Hore-Belisha, Leslie | Roberts, Aled (Wrexham) |
| Brass, Captain Sir William | Horshrugh, Florence | Rothschild, James A. de |
| Briscoe, Capt. Richard George | Hudson, Capt. A. U. M. (Hackney, N.) | Runge, Norah Cecil |
| Broadbent, Colonel John | Hudson, Robert Spear (Southport) | Rutherford, John (Edmonton) |
| Brocklebank, C. E. R. | Hutchison, W. D. (Essex, Romf'd) | Salmon, Sir Isidore |
| Brown, Col. D. C. (N'th'l'd., Hexham) | Jackson, Sir Henry (Wandsworth, C.) | Samuel, Rt. Hon. Sir H. (Darwen) |
| Brown, Ernest (Leith) | Jerson, Major Thomas E. | Sandman, Sir A. N. Stewart |
| Brown, Brig.-Gen. H. C.(Berks., Newb'y) | Joel, Dudley J. Barnato | Sanderson, Sir Frank Barnard |
| Buchan-Hepburn, P. G. T. | Johnstone, Harcourt (S. Shields) | Sassoon, Rt. Hon. Sir Philip A. G. D. |
| Caine, G. R. Hall. | Jones, Lewis (Swansea, West) | Sinclair, Maj. Rt. Hn. Sir A. (C'thness) |
| Campbell, Sir Edward Taswell (Brmly) | Knight, Holford | Slater, John |
| Caporn, Arthur Cecil | Knox, Sir Alfred | Smith, Louis W. (Sheffield, Hallam) |
| Carver, Major William H. | Lamb, Sir Joseph Quinton | Somervell, Donald Bradley |
| Cayzer, Maj. Sir H. R. (Prtsmth., S.) | Law, Sir Alfred | Southby, Commander Archibald R. J. |
| Cazaiet, Capt. V. A. (Chippenham) | Leech, Dr. J. W. | Spans, William Patrick |
| Cochrane, Commander Hon. A. D. | Lindsay, Noel Ker | Stanley, Lord (Lancaster, Fylde) |
| Colville, Lieut.-Colonel J. | Llewellin, Major John J. | Stanley, Hon. O. F. G. (Westmorland) |
| Conant, R. J. E. | Llewellyn-Jones, Frederick | Storey, Samuel |
| Cook, Thomas A. | Lloyd, Geoffrey | Stuart, Lord C. Crichton |
| Cooke, Douglas | Lockwood, John C. (Hackney, C.) | Sugden, Sir Wilfrid Hart |
| Courthope, Colonel Sir George L. | Mabane, William | Thomas, James P. L. (Hereford) |
| Cranborne, Viscount | MacAndrew, Lieut.-Col. C. G. (Penick) | Todd, Capt. A. J. K. (B'wick-on-T.) |
| Crookshank, Col. C. de Windt (Bootle) | MacAndrew, Capt. J. O. (Ayr) | Tryon, Rt. Hon. George Clement |
| Crookshank, Capt. H. C. (Gainsb'ro) | Macdonald, Capt. P. D. (I. of W.) | Wallace, Captain D. E. (Homey) |
| Cross, R. H. | McEwen, Captain J. H. F. | Wallace, John (Dunfermline) |
| Davies, Maj. Geo. F. (Somerset, Yeovil) | McKeag, William | Ward, Lt.-Col. Sir A. L. (Hull) |
| Dawson, Sir Philip | Makins, Brigadier-General Ernest | Waterhouse, Captain Charles |
| Denman, Hon. R. D. | Mallalleu, Edward Lancelot | Watt, Captain George Steven H. |
| Donner, P. W. | Mander, Geoffrey le M. | Weymouth, Viscount |
| Doran, Edward | Mayhew, Lieut.-Colonel John | Williams, Charles (Devon, Torquay) |
| Drawe, Cadric | Mills, Sir Frederick (Leyton, E.) | Wills, Wilfrid D. |
| Edmondson, Major A. J. | Monseil, Rt. Hon. Sir B. Eyree | Wood, Rt. Hon. Sir H. Kingsley |
| Elliot, Major Rt. Hon. Waiter E. | Morris, Owen Temple (Cardiff, E.) | Young, Rt. Hon. Sir Hilton (S'v'noaks) |
| Emmott, Charles E. G. C. | Mulrhead, Major A. J. | Young, Ernest J. (Middlesbrough, E.) |
| Everard, W. Lindsay | Nation, Brigadier-General J. J. H. | |
| Flelden, Edward Brocklehurst | Nicholson, Godfrey (Morpedh) | TELLERS FOR THE AYES.— |
| Fleming, Edward Lascelles | North, Edward T. | Captain Margesson and Captain |
| Sir George Bowyer. |
| NOES. | ||
| Batey, Joseph | Healy, Cahir | Price, Gabriel |
| Brown, C. W. E. (Notts., Mansfield) | Hirst, George Henry | Salter, Dr. Alfred |
| Buchanan, George | Kirkwood, David | Smith, Tom (Normanton) |
| Cape, Thomas | Lawson, John James | Tinker, John Joseph |
| Cove, William G. | Leonard, William | Williams, Edward John (Ogmore) |
| Dagger, George | Logan, David Gilbert | |
| Graham, D. M. (Lanark, Hamilton) | Macdonald, Gordon (Ince) | TELLERS FOR THE NOES.— |
| Groves, Thomas E. | McEntee, Valentine L. | Mr. Kirkwood and Mr. Aneurin |
| Grundy, Thomas W. | Maclean, Nell (Glasgow, Govan) | Bevan. |
| Hall, George H. (Merthyr Tydvil) | Parkinson, John Allen |
§ Mr. SPEAKERThe hon. Member for Shettleston (Mr. McGovern) will withdraw from the House immediately.
§ Mr. McGOVERNMr. Speaker, I accept the decision of the House, and withdraw.
§ The hon. Member thereupon withdrew from the House.