CONFERENCE PROPOSALS. (Hansard, 7 April 1921)

§ The PRIME MINISTER

I was not present when the last few speeches in the discussion took place, and I did not hear the speeches of the right hon. Gentleman (Mr. Henderson) and the right hon. Gentleman (Mr. Thomas). I understand, however, that they made certain suggestions and I understand the suggestion of the right hon. Gentleman (Mr. Henderson) was made after consultation with representatives of the miners. I am not sure whether the same observation applies to my right hon. Friend (Mr. Thomas). I have been trying to get the actual words that were used, and when there has been so much misunderstanding about words, a good deal depends upon the actual phrases used. Unfortunately, I have been unable to secure anything like a transcript of the actual phrases, but perhaps I shall be corrected if this is an inaccurate summary of the right hon. Gentleman (Mr. Thomas). His suggestion was that the Government should summon a conference of both miners and owners to consider first the question of pumping, and that that question should be disposed of before any other question was entered upon. That was, I understand, the suggestion of the right hon. Gentleman the Member for Derby. My right hon. Friend the Member for Miles Platting (Mr. Clynes) used certain words in the course of his speech which conveyed that impression. As far as the Government are concerned, the only position we have taken is that the question of pumping and of the safety 605 of the mines must be disposed of before we can enter upon negotiations on questions which must necessarily occupy a very considerable time. If, however, there is a disposition to accept the suggestion of the right hon. Gentleman the Member for Derby, and to have a discussion on the question of pumping first and dispose of it before any other question is entered upon, we certainly should have no objection to taking part in a conference upon that subject.

The action we took this morning indicated that that was a question we were willing to enter upon a discussion of at any time, and we should certainly take any step that was necessary for the purpose of summoning the parties together to discuss that question, provided that it was clear, in the words of the right hon. Gentleman the Member for Derby, that that would be the first question, and that that question would be disposed of before any other question was entered upon. We still think that the course of procedure which was adopted this morning was the best, and that it would be far better that this question should be discussed separately, in the first place with the representatives of the miners, and afterwards with the representatives of the coalowners, which is the old procedure always adopted in the case of stoppages in the mines. The meetings of coalowners and of miners' representatives when they come together are very large and unwieldy, and my right hon. Friend knows perfectly well that we have never been able to secure an arrangement by which a small body will be accepted as representing the miners, and a similar small body as representing the owners, which is the only effective body for the purpose of negotiating details. When you have a meeting of miners and mineowners, it is usually a meeting of 75 persons—an obviously impossible body for the purposes of discussing a practical proposition. We certainly will not stand in the way of summoning a conference of that kind for the purpose of' discussing this question if it were agreed that it would be the first question to be discussed and disposed of before we enter upon any other proceedings. If that is the suggestion that is put forward, the Government are prepared to take any steps necessary for the purpose of summoning the conference.

Mr. HENDERSON

I regret that it was not possible for the Prime Minister to give a little notice that he was going to make an important statement based upon the speech of my right hon. Friend the Member for Derby (Mr. Thomas). Unfortunately, my right hon. Friend was not very well and went home early. One can quite understand the anxiety through which he is passing, but had I had a little notice I should have made an effort and perhaps succeeded in bringing him back to the House, in view of the important statement that was to be made. In face of these facts, I think it would be inadvisable for me to say more than I said earlier in the Debate. I then said I had been in consultation with the officials of the Miners' Federation of Great Britain and that they took up the position to-day that they took up on Wednesday, that they were quite prepared to go into an open conference without conditions on either side, and I on my own responsibility ventured to suggest that that was an entirely different thing to raise the highly important question of the safety men when once the conference was open to making it a preliminary to the securing of the conference. That statement was made with the knowledge of the officials of the Miners' Federation of Great Britain. Beyond that I do not go, I cannot go, at this moment, and therefore I think, in view of the momentous character of the statement and the seriousness of the position in the country, the only safe line to follow would be for the Prime Minister to put the statement he has now made before the House into a letter to the officials, and give them an opportunity of considering it to-morrow morning and of taking the responsibility, on behalf of their members, of either accepting it, so that the conference may be immediately organised, or of refusing it.

I think the Prime Minister will see that not having had any notice and not having had an opportunity even of conferring, since the afternoon, with the Miners' Federation officials, it would be quite impossible for me to make any more useful suggestion than the one I have just put forward.