Commons Sitting of 16 August 1838

MINUTES.
Petitions presented. By Mr. LEADER, from Tradesmen, and other Inhabitants of Glasgow, to extend the Royal mercy to the men who were lately condemned at Edinburgh for a conspiracy at Glasgow; from the Working Men's Association at Carmarthen, praying that the twenty-three persons, eight of whom had been sent to Bermuda by order of the Governor-General of Canada, and the remaining fifteen forbidden to enter the province on pain of death, may receive a full, free, and unconditional Pardon.—By Mr. HAWES, against any Alteration of the Beer Act.—By Mr. O. CAVE, from the Chairman and Secretary of a Society in the county of Tipperary, for the Total Abolition of Tithes in Ireland.—By Sir R. INGLIS, from Slingsby, in favour of the Established Church in Canada; from Oxbroke (Derby), against the Encouragement of Idolatrous practices in the East Indies; and from the Clergy and Archdeaconry of Colchester, against any measure for settling Parochial Assessments similar to the late Bill.

LABOURS OF THE SESSION.
Sir R. Inglis, after having presented some petitions, said, he hoped he might be allowed to take that opportunity of congratulating the right hon. Gentleman in the chair, and the House generally, on the termination of a Session of almost unexampled duration, toil, and fatigue. He found that the House had now sat 173 days, during which no less than 1,134 hours had been occupied with public business, a number which was unexampled in the annals of Parliament, with the exception of a single year, in which the amount had been exceeded, partly on account of the morning sittings which were then on trial, and partly owing to the lengthened discussions on the Reform Bill, which was pending that Session. But if they compared the labours of the last Session with those which their predecessors had to undergo, indeed, if they went back only so far as the reign of George 4th, or the beginning of William 4th, the contrast would appear most striking. In the first Session after the accession of the former monarch, the House of Commons had sat only 111 days. In the first Session of William 4th they sat only 84 days, and rolling this as it was rolled into the last Session of George 4th, still the united number of days only reached 107. The first Session of the present century was the longest previous to the Session just past, the number of days occupied by sittings being 132. He thought the country must see with satisfaction the testimony of attention to the duties of legislation exhibited in the numbers he had mentioned, but while he thought this, he could not bet feel also, that there was no

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circumstance connected with the Session which would tend to give less satisfaction than the great number of Bills which had been introduced into that House within the last few weeks. No less than sixty-four new Bills had been introduced since the 1st of July, a number exceeding the entire amount that had been presented in the first three months of the Session. He was very glad to see that an hon. Member had given notice of a motion calculated to correct this evil for the early part of next Session, and he must say, he earnestly trusted that it would be persevered in, as he thought the subject deserving of the gravest consideration on the part of the House.
Subject dropped.

THE POOR-LAW.
Sir C. Douglas, in rising to move, pursuant to notice, "that each assistant Poor-law Commissioner do forthwith prepare a report to the board at Somerset-house, as to how far he may be of opinion, that the regulations now in force for refusing out of door relief in money to the able-bodied, and for the separation of man and wife in the workhouses after sixty years of age each, should or should not be modified, stating the reasons for whichever view he may take," said, that in the course which he had pursued on the subject of the Poor-law he was anxious, it should not be thought, he had intended in any way to mislead the public, and he must say, he deeply regretted, that nothing had been done on the subject. It was one on which he was quite convinced political heats and party feelings ought to have no place, and he had refused to accede to the motion brought forward by the hon. Member for Oldham in the early part of the Session, and thereby shown, that he acquiesced generally in the principles of the Poor-law Amendment Act. But, he must add, that he did think Government might have been able, had they taken up the subject early in the Session, when there was a full attendance of Members, to have passed such a measure, for the modification of the powers of the commissioners in those particulars to which his motion referred—viz., out-door relief to the able-bodied, and the separation of the sexes, as would have given general satisfaction throughout the country. At present, however, he had risen to call attention to the subject, chiefly for the purpose of showing, that
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there were Members—he believed, a number of Members—in that house who were earnestly desirous of giving a careful and deliberate consideration to these questions. With reference to the notice on the subject which he had placed on the books some time ago, he had felt, that it would be improper for him to make that motion until after the Poor-law committee should have terminated their labours, and made their final report (which had only just been done); he had made his notice contingent upon that event. He was anxious that there should be no misapprehension on this point. With respect to the delay which had taken place in presenting the final report of the Poor-law committee, that delay was justified, in his opinion, by the circumstances to which it was attributable. He thought, that the recess would be well employed by every Member of the House in digesting the report of the Committee, and in consulting with their constituents and ascertaining their feeling. He should certainly feel it his duty to press the subject on the notice of the House on an early day in next Session; but in the mean time, it was his earnest hope, that her Majesty's Government would see the necessity of directing their attention to the wishes of the people expressed as they had been in almost innumerable petitions on this subject. Once for all, he would say, that his object was, to tender the Poor-law more consonant to the wishes of the poor themselves, and though he thought, that it was by the Government, that the country had a right to expect, that a matter of so much importance should be brought under consideration, still if no one more able were found, he should persist in pressing the subject.
Mr. Freshfieldsaid, that the Poor-law committee, great as had been their labours felt no regret in reference to those labours. They complained of nothing. Four days in every week, and five or six hours each day, they had devoted to their duties; but the time they had given to the inquiry, extended as it was, was no more than necessary in order to render the proceedings satisfactory to the public generally, as well as to those who had evidence to produce on the subject, both on the one side and on the other. And he must add, that whatever desire hon. Members might generally feel to show humanity and benevolence towards the poor in their ad-

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dresses in the House on this question, of which the importance to the public was so well known, there could be nowhere more strong feelings of this kind than were manifested in the committee. He had gone into that committee with very strong prepossessions on the subject, but he found in a short time that the great feeling was in favour of carrying the Act into operation with humanity and attention to the wishes of the poor.
Mr. Briscoemoved as an Amendment for a return of the number of married couples confined in workhouses in England and Wales, stating the number in each workhouse and the age and state of health of the parties. A great deal of misconception had got abroad as to the number of married persons in the workhouses, and it was not generally known that the boards of guardians had very extensive powers of giving out-door relief to married couples above the age of 60. With a view of ascertaining something of what was the state of the case in Surrey, he had
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found that in the union of Croydon, consisting of Croydon parish, with a population of 12,000, and twelve adjacent parishes, there were only two married couples in the workhouse, and in each case the parties being blind and totally helpless, received every care, had a nurse to attend upon them, and every thing else which could be done to alleviate their sad condition. He hoped there would be no objection to the returns as, if they were made, the House would be put in possession of very important documents with respect to the extent of the evils of separation, which were so much complained of.
The motions were put separately and both negatived.
The Gentleman Usher of the Black Rod summoned the House to attend Her Majesty in the House of Lords. The House accordingly went, and after some time returned, when the Speaker, sitting at the Table, read her Majesty's speech and then the Members separated.