HL Deb 06 February 1990 vol 515 cc698-700

2.50 p.m.

Baroness Seear asked Her Majesty's Government:

What action they are taking to avoid potential conflict between the requirements of the General Certificate of Secondary Education (GCSE) and the requirements of the national curriculum.

Baroness Blatch

My Lords, there is to be a single framework of assessment for pupils at the age of 16 whereby pupils will be assessed within 10 levels of achievement on the national curriculum scale. The main form of assessment will be the GCSE and pupils will be awarded a GCSE certificate if they achieve level 4 or better. GCSEs will be available in single subjects and also in combinations of subjects. The Schools Examinations and Assessment Council is developing revised GCSE national criteria embodying the statutory attainment targets and programmes of study for the foundation subjects.

Baroness Seear

My Lords, I thank the noble Baroness for that interesting reply. May we interpret it as meaning that there will be greater flexibility in the teaching available to youngsters between the ages of 14 and 16?

Baroness Blatch

My Lords, the noble Baroness has picked up a concern expressed by all our secondary schools. That was the single most common concern that has come back from the secondary schools. I am happy to say that my right honourable friend the Secretary of State responded positively to that concern in his speech to the Society of Education Officers on 25th January. He has called for a broad and balanced curriculum, flexibility to meet the needs of all children from the most able to the least able and —another important feature—continuity between stages of education —primary, secondary, further and higher education.

Lord Taylor of Blackburn

My Lords, how does the Minister's reply this afternoon compare with the report of Her Majesty's Inspector of Schools which was published yesterday and in which the inspector was not happy about the way in which things are going at present?

Baroness Blatch

My Lords, I do not know about the report. I have not seen it, but it has probably not kept up with the pace of change. My right honourable friend the Secretary of State intends to amend the 1989 information regulations to introduce the flexibility called for by teachers with regard to what is known in the jargon as Key Stage 4 for all children aged between 14 and 16. I am convinced that, if the noble Lord reads the speech, which is deposited in the Library, he will be heartened by the detail in which it sets out the flexibility that will apply to children of all abilities.

Lord Gainford

My Lords, will that flexibility allow pupils to drop subjects before the fourth year of secondary education?

Baroness Blatch

My Lords, my right honourable friend the Secretary of State is sticking to the original suggestion that core subjects, plus technology and modern languages, will have to be studied to the end of Key Stage 4. However, for the brightest pupils, there will be flexibility to substitute subjects during that key stage and for the least able there will also be flexibility to introduce other subjects. To that end, BTEC, City and Guilds and Royal Society of Arts qualifications will also be considered to dovetail into the attainment scale.

Baroness David

My Lords, is the Minister aware that we are pleased that there will be greater flexibility, as we had all expected? We gather that there is a certain amount of trouble in getting teachers to agree to do all the assessment and examining that will be necessary in all key stages and that they will be thoroughly exhausted by the time they reach Key Stage 4. Perhaps I may say ——

Noble Lords

No!

Baroness David

My Lords, perhaps I may ask that, when the noble Baroness has had time to read the Chief Inspector's report, she will add her voice to the need for greater flexibility still and for a little less assessment which takes up the time of teachers who are much needed for other purposes.

Baroness Blatch

My Lords, I take the noble Baroness's point about the need for flexibility. That is important, but it is also important that we do not return to the bad old days of so much flexibility that nothing is studied in any depth. The balance between core foundation subjects and flexibility with the non-core foundation subjects is problably the best bet for our young children.

Lord Peston

My Lords, as I indicated to the noble Baroness, the document to which reference was made is freely available even to Ministers. I assure her that it makes extremely interesting reading.

Noble Lords

Question!

Lord Peston

My Lords, I shall get to the question; there is no problem there at all. Is the noble Baroness aware that, in referring to the speech made by her right honourable friend the Secretary of State, the Times Educational Supplement stated that, in the eyes of the head teachers who will bear the brunt of managing the package of measures that he announced last week to a stunned Society of Education Officers, he failed on all three counts dealing with overcrowding, fragmentation and certification? Is it not a serious state of affairs when a distinguished journal such as the Times Educational Supplement believes that it should say that kind of thing about the Secretary of State's speech?

Baroness Blatch

My Lords, I hope that the noble Lord will forgive me for not yet having read that document. The House sat until about three this morning, I was in my bed at 4 a.m., on the road again at quarter to eight and have been at meetings ever since.

Noble Lords

Hear, hear!

Baroness Blatch

My Lords, I have however read in detail the whole speech made by my right honourable friend the Secretary of State on 25th January in which he dealt in great detail with the overcrowding, fragmentation and certification issues. I should prefer to return to that question when the noble Lord has read the speech in the same detail as I have done.