§ * LORD BELPERin rising to ask Her Majesty's Government whether there was any probability of the Reports from the County Councils on the proposals of the Boundaries Commissioners being received in time to enable the schemes to be laid before Parliament during the present Session, and, if so, what was the latest date at which the Reports should be presented to the Local Government Board, said: My Lords, I need not detain the House more than two minutes in putting the question of which I have given notice, but I think it is a matter of some importance that the various Council Authorities should have an authoritative statement upon this matter. As I understand the proposals of the Boundaries Commissioners have to be submitted to the County Councils for their Report, and such Reports have to be submitted to the Local Government Board, and after the Local Government Board have come to their decision, the scheme will be laid on the Table of the House for a month before being finally adopted by Parliament. I understand that it is the intention of the Government to bring in a Bill with respect to forming District Councils during the present Session of Parliament. It is obvious that if the Bill is passed this Session, and new District Councils are formed in the course of the forthcoming winter, it will be extremely desirable that the new County boundaries should be fixed.
§ LORD THRINGBefore the noble Lord answers the question I would like to ask a question immediately arising out of the matter to which the noble Lord has drawn attention. The noble Lord has referred to the local inquiries made by the Local Government Board. It is of the greatest possible importance in many parts of the country that these local inquiries should be made in the evening, because the working classes are extremely interested in the 346 alteration of the areas, and they are unable to attend except in the evening. It is the practice at present for the Local Government Board to make their inquiries in the middle of the day. I trust that it will be deemed expedient to hold these inquiries in the future in the evening so that the views may be ascertained of the people in whose interests the inquiries are really held.
§ THE EARL OF POWISMay I ask the noble Lord who represents the Local Government Board what locus standi individual parishes will have to make their representations to the Board as to the decision of the Boundaries Commissioners—I refer to places which are not of a nature to necessitate a local inquiry; and whether the Local Government Board or the Boundaries Commissioners will issue any rules or notices so that every parish may know in what manner the action of the Boundaries Commissioners will affect them?
* LORD BALFOURI have to ask the House to allow me to reply to these questions on behalf of the noble Lord who represents the Local Government Board in this House. With regard to the question which the noble Lord opposite has put upon the Paper, I may explain to the House that there are three kinds of alteration of boundary which are covered by his question. There are the alterations of the boundaries of counties; there are the alterations of the boundaries of unions which overlap the boundaries of counties; and there are the alterations of boundaries of boroughs, which are not what are technically called Urban Sanitary Districts. With regard to the latter class of inquiry, that class of boroughs which are not Urban Sanitary Districts, Provisional Orders confirming reports either have been laid on the Table of one or other of the Houses of Parliament, or will be during the present Session of Parliament. With regard to the alteration for boundaries of counties, several applications for local inquiries have been received by the Local Government Board; but looking to the time which must necessarily elapse, considering the intricate nature of the questions involved and the fact that in all cases a local inquiry will be required and that some time will have to be given for the Local Govern- 347 ment Board to decide upon the merits of the questions at issue. I am afraid it will be impossible to promise that those reports will be received in time to be confirmed by Parliament during the present Session. With regard to the alterations of the boundaries of unions they do not, I understand, require confirmation by Parliament, but are practically under the control of the Local Government Board, and they will he proceeded with, as circumstances allow, with the utmost rapidity possible. I think I have covered the whole of the ground of the question upon the Paper. With regard to the observations of the the noble Lord opposite (Lord Thring), I have to say that I suppose the noble Lord and the House will agree that it is obviously desirable that these inquiries should be held at such times in all cases as are most convenient to the majority of the persons concerned. It has been the practice of the Local Government Board to hold the inquiries under the Allotments Act, which specially are held to concern the working classes in the evening. That is a new departure which was taken with the express purpose of meeting the convenience of the working classes. As regards inquiries such as are alluded to in this question, I have to say that it will not be possible to give any general undertaking that in all cases they will be held in the evening, but if in any particular case it is represented to be more convenient that the inquiry should be held in the evening, if representations are made to the Local Government Board that that course will meet with general approval, the Local Government Board will consider the circumstances, and do what they can to meet the convenience of the majority of the parties concerned. I cannot, however, give a general undertaking that in all cases the inquiries shall be held in the evening, because that might not be suitable to the majority of those concerned. With regard to the question put to me by the noble Lord behind me (the Earl of Powis), I think there are general directions laid down in the Act as to the particular bodies which will have a locus standi in these inquiries. It is desirable to get at the truth, and for that purpose considerable latitude will no doubt be given to those who can show a real interest in the matter. I am not able to say whether definite regulations 348 have been, or can be, laid down; but if the noble Lord will confer with me afterwards, I will endeavour to get for him any instructions which have been given.
§ * LORD BELPERPerhaps I may be allowed to say one word with regard to the answer of the noble Lord. The point that I wished specially to refer to in my question was with regard to the boundaries of counties where unions overlapped the boundaries of the counties, and where it will be necessary for the Commissioners either to alter the boundaries of the counties, or to alter the boundaries of the union. I would point out to the noble Lord that with respect to those cases, inquiries have been already held, and the result of those inquiries and the reports of the Commissioners have been embodied in a Blue Book presented to your Lordships' House, and those reports have been sent down to the County Councils to report upon. Therefore the position you are in is that you are waiting for the report not of the Local Government Board, but of the County Council. Of course, the Local Government Board will naturally wish to express their opinion as to whether they adopt the report of the County Councils or the report of the Boundaries Commissioners in any case where they differ. In cases where they agree, I daresay the Local Government Board will at once adopt the report, and lay it upon the Table of the House. But my question was particularly directed to the cases in which the two reports differed, and I think it would be well if the noble Lord would give us some information as to the probability of bringing in a Bill this year dealing with the matter.
* LORD BALFOURThe question of the noble Lord distinctly refers to Reports still to come in. I thought I had sufficiently pointed out that after these Reports were received some little time must necessarily elapse—I hope not long, but still some time—for the Local Government Board to make up their minds upon the merits of the Report transmitted to them. I would also point out that, as the noble Lord is probably well aware, the time for introducing Provisional Orders into Parliament this Session has already expired. If there are requests still to be sent in, and to be considered by the Local Government Board, and these inquiries 349 to be held, they can only be received so late in the Session that it will probably be most convenient that any proposals that may be submitted to Parliament should be left for confirmation next Session.
§ * THE MARQUESS OF RIPONMy Lords, I am the last person to wish to interfere needlessly with the Standing Orders, but I want to point out to the noble Lord the great public inconvenience which will result if the county boundaries are not settled as soon as possible. I have no doubt that many of the County Councils have already got their reports ready and can send them in at once. My own County Council has appointed a Committee, which has made its report, and it will be sent up before long in all probability to the Local Government Board. If we are to wait until a Bill passes through Parliament next Session, the County Councils will be put to a very great degree of unnecessary inconvenience. It is a very special case, and one in which I think in both Houses there would be great readiness to dispense with the Standing Orders in order to avoid a public inconvenience of that kind. I would, therefore, venture to urge earnestly upon the noble Lord that he should, if possible, settle this question this year. If the noble Lord will name the last day upon which he will receive the reports of the County Councils, I am sure all the County Councils will endeavour to meet him.
* LORD BALFOURI am afraid it is not possible for me to give the promise which the noble Marquess asks for. I am informed that at the present time very few reports have actually come in. A great number are expected, and they must be decided upon some general principle which will govern the large majority of them. Upon this great majority of them there will, I believe, be further inquiry. I should be very sorry if a serious inconvenience should arise, and I will give the noble Marquess this undertaking. The strong protest and request which he has made in this House shall be considered by the Local Government Board. I think the House will see that, having been only asked since I came here to make the answer on behalf of the Local Government to the question on which notice was given, I have done all I 350 could to give all the information in my power.