§ South Metropolitan Gas Light and Coke Company Bill reported with Amendments; Gaslight and Coke Company Bill reported from the Select Committee, with Amendments.
§ LORD REDESDALEintimated that as there appeared, from the discussion that had recently taken place, to be considerable differences as to the merits of the Bills before the House promoted by the Gas Light and Coke Company and the South Metropolitan Gas Company, he thought it would be advisable that they should be referred to a Committee of the Whole House, instead of to a Select Committee in the usual course. At the proper time he would move a Resolution to that effect.
THE EARL OF CAMPERDOWNapproved of the course suggested. He would in Committee move Amendments to the Bills, Notice of which he would give as soon as possible. It would probably be convenient that he should now state the general objections he had to the Bills. With regard to the Bill of the Gas Light and Coke Company, his chief objection to it was that the Company sought nominally to raise an additional capital of £2,000,000, but in reality that increased capital would amount to £3,000,000, because there was already power to raise £1,000,000 by loan, and this additional £2,000,000 was to be raised by a sale of the shares by public auction. The Bill also proposed to fix the initial price of their gas at 1129 3s. 9d. per 1,000 feet, which would enable the Company to pay a dividend of 10 per cent. This being so, the price of the £100 shares in the open market would be about £200; so that when Parliament was asked to sanction the issue of an additional £1,000,000 worth of shares, they were really adding £2,000,000 to the capital of the Company. According to the last accounts he had of those Companies, he found that in the Spring of last year there was an amalgamation between the Gas Light and the Independent and the Imperial Companies. Before their amalgamation took place the Imperial Company promoted a Bill which asked for a large increase of capital. That Bill, however, was opposed and withdrawn. Those who opposed it now complained that the Gas Light and Coke Company having taken over the Imperial were seeking by means of this Bill to obtain the same powers they previously resisted. This, he considered, was a great hardship upon those who had previously contested the matter. He understood that the Imperial and Independent Companies had power as yet unexercised of raising by shares and loans £1,200,000. If they were to have a Committee, the first question he should ask was why this enormous additional capital was required? As he was advised, it was required for renewing many of the works of the Companies; but if it was intended to expend it on a scheme of total renovation he was by no means sure that the Gas Companies were the best bodies to carry this work out. If the House considered the increase to be necessary, he urged that it should be raised by loan, and not by the sale of shares as proposed. The noble Duke (the Duke of Richmond) the other night said it might depreciate the credit of a Company if they were obliged to raise very large sums by loan only; but in the case of those now under review, they were Companies with almost unlimited powers, whose shares were quoted upon the Stock Exchange, and he therefore could not conceive that they would suffer any injury.
THE LORD CHANCELLORsaid, he was sorry to interrupt the noble Earl but it was a serious violation of Order to discuss the merits of a Bill which was not before the House, or to raise questions of which no Notice had been given.
THE EARL OF CAMPERDOWNwas in the hands of the House, but he had thought it might be convenient to indicate the points he desired to raise.
THE DUKE OF RICHMOND AND GORDONsaid, he had not himself liked to interfere in a way which might appear discourteous towards the noble Earl, as they had had one or two previous discussions on that matter; but he concurred with the noble and learned Lord on the Woolsack, that there could scarcely be any course more inconvenient or irregular than that of entering into the merits of a Bill not before their Lord ships, merely upon a Notice of Motion being given by his noble Friend at the Table (Lord Redesdale) that on a future day, not yet even fixed, he would ask them to refer those Bills to a Committee of the Whole House. He wished to suggest, before his noble Friend at the Table made his Motion, whether it would not be more convenient that those Bills should be referred to a Select Committee, because there were points in them which could not be discussed in Committee of the Whole House. It might be necessary to call the parties and to hear evidence, and that could only be done by referring the Bills to a Select Committee. As to the initial price of 3s. 6d. per, 6000 feet, that was the price settled by the Committee presided over by Lord Cardwell.
§ EARL FORTESCUEwas proceeding to offer some observations to the House, when—
§ THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURYobjected to the continuance of an irregular discussion.