§ Order of the Day for the Second Heading, read.
§ LORD ROMILLYsaid, that in asking the House to give a second reading to this Bill he would only delay for a few moments a more interesting discussion. The measure was a very small, but, he believed, would be a very useful one. Great, inconvenience and expense were caused by the necessity of having the property of a charity vested in all the trustees, and when any of the trustees died conveying to new trustees, as also by the execution of leases by absent trustees. The Bill, therefore, would enable charities to become corporations by application to and with the sanction of the Charity Commissioners. They would then be able to grant leases under their common seal, their affairs being otherwise carried on exactly as at present. He had submitted the Bill to his noble and learned Friend on the Woolsack, and had withdrawn a clause to which objections might have been offered.
§ Moved, "That the Bill be now read 2a" —(The Lord Romilly.)
THE LORD CHANCELLORconcurred in the object of the Bill—namely, the relieving charities from the necessity, upon every new appointment of trustees, of having new conveyances and deeds, 356 there being a difficulty sometimes in ascertaining who the proper trustees were. He thought, however, that the clause referring to land did not sufficiently guard the Law of Mortmain, the provisions of which ought not to be infringed, and he believed it would be more expedient to adopt only that part of the Bill which enabled trustees to be incorporated. This he preferred to the incorporation of the charities themselves, many of them being very ephemeral, though not so notoriously so that the Charity Commissioners would exercise their veto on the incorporation; and the granting of a charter of incorporation being a Prerogative of the Crown, he doubted the propriety of transferring it to the Commissioners. The fact of its incorporation might mislead persons, by giving it greater apparent importance than it really possessed, and the incorporation of trustees would meet all the exigencies of the case.
§ LORD CAIRNSsaid, that, so far from regarding the Bill in its present shape as a small one, it seemed to him one of the most gigantic ever brought before the House. It would sweep away the whole Law of Mortmain, interfere with the Sovereign's Prerogative of granting charters, and would enable every reading society, book or blanket club, or collection of persons assembled for any purpose which could be described as pertaining to literature, science, art, or religion, to obtain a certificate of incorporation and use a common seal. There were no provisions enabling these bodies to be sued or giving execution against their property or any of their members. The power of incorporation was a high Prerogative, which ought not to be lightly transferred or exercised; and he hoped the noble and learned Lord be- fore the Bill was committed would frame Amendments entirely altering its character—for he was sure that in its pre- sent shape their Lordships would not pass it.
§ LORD ROMILLYsaid, lie would endeavour to frame Amendments before the Bill went into Committee, and would submit them to the bodies interested, with the view of ascertaining how the object in view could be best carried out.
§ Motion agreed to; Bill read 2a accordingly.