§ House in Committee (according to order).
§ THE DUKE OF SOMERSET, in moving that the House do go into Committee on this Bill said, that after the full discussions which had recently taken place on the importance of a naval reserve force, he was sure that any provision which could possibly add to the naval reserves of the country would meet with their Lordships' approbation. The present Bill emanated from the Report of a Commission, but only dealt with one of their several recommendations, as it was thought that it would be inconvenient to mix together different subjects in one Bill. The Bill was confined to the one point of a naval reserve force, and in its form somewhat resembled a measure previously brought in relating to the Naval Coast Volunteers; but in its intention it was very different. The previous measure dealt with those fishermen and others on the coast who were naturally unwilling to be taken away from the country, and, therefore, though they might be made available for manning gunboats and other small craft, were not 1335 available when a fleet required to be manned. Consequently, it was thought desirable by the Commission that another force should be created, and it was believed that by offering to sea-faring men a small sum by way of retaining fee, and a pension after some years' service, they would be willing to enrol themselves, go through a drill, and be ready on a sudden emergency to man the fleet. So far as experience went there were some grounds for believing that this measure would be effectual for its purpose, because the Naval Coast Volunteers had been enrolled to the number, he was told of 6,000 or 7,000, of whom 5,000 were well trained and as efficient as any other men in the navy. Still, the necessity for the services of a class more effective for the defence of the country led to the introduction of the present Bill, which proposed to give £5 a year and the pay of seamen during 28 days' drill to such as enrolled themselves. These sailors might go to any part of the world they pleased, so long as it was known where they were to be found. There would be no objection to their going to distant places, for if war broke out sailors would be wanted not only here but in other parts of the world. The plan adopted in the Bill was an experiment, and, as such, powers were only taken in the Bill to make regulations. The excellence of the plan would of course depend on these regulations, which would be made by the Admiralty, communicating with the Board of Trade, shipping masters, and persons best able to suggest what regulations would be most likely to bring the seamen in the manner wanted. What was desired in the first instance was that a beginning should be cautiously made. If the number of men enrolled should amount, as was anticipated, to 30,000, that would entail at once an annual expense of £150,000; but to this would have to be added the expense of the 28 days' pay and provisions for the period of drill; so that including minor expenses, and supposing the whole to be embodied, they might reckon the annual outlay at £280,000. The Government wished to see the enterprise begun, though they did not expect to get the men all at once, but the object would be to render the measure popular among seamen and shipping masters, and then they might look forward to obtaining an effective force. This was no party question, for all persons were equally anxious that some measure of this sort should succeed. It had been examined with great care by the Commis- 1336 sioners, by whom it was almost unanimously agreed to. Mr. Lindsay had drawn up another and a valuable report, and to many of the suggestions due attention would be paid by the Admiralty. He would add that the present measure by itself was not all that was required for producing a good reserve. Another important measure was the training of boys in training schools, so that in a few years they would become good sailors. That measure he thought would be wise, but it would require great consideration, and it was thought better not to mix the questions up together in the present Bill, When the plans which he had mentioned should be carried out, he did not doubt but that we should have rendered impressment unnecessary, if it were still possible, and, moreover, we should have a better body of seamen than under any system of impressment. As he had said, this plan was only an experiment, but he had sanguine hopes of its success, and no efforts would be wanting on the part of the Government to render it effective in providing a sufficient reserve of seamen.
§ THE EARL OF ELLENBOROUGHsaid, he viewed the introduction of this Bill with very great pleasure, and hoped it would be successful. He thought they were greatly indebted to the Gentlemen who formed the Royal Commission for the very valuable Report they had made. He had, however, one apprehension with respect to the working of this measure. The object of the measure was to provide a force for home service in case of emergency. Those seamen engaged in short voyages or in the coasting trade would have no difficulty in presenting themselves each year for training under this Bill; but those who were engaged in long voyages to Australia and the East Indies would, he apprehended, often not be forthcoming when called upon. He should like to know whether the engagement would be restricted to those seamen who were most likely to be forthcoming when wanted.
§ THE DUKE OF SOMERSETsaid, the Bill did not provide either way upon that point, which would have to be dealt with by the regulations. His own impression was that it would be unwise to limit the distance to which sailors should be allowed to go, but rather to provide that wherever they were they should be under the provision of the Act.
§ THE EARL OF ELLENBOROUGHsuggested that at least each sailor who went upon a long voyage should only do so upon 1337 condition of providing a substitute to ap pear for him in case of absence.
§ Bill reported, without Amendment, and to be read 3a To-morrow.